Call for presumed liability against motorists v cyclists

[jaf01uk]

Calls for the Scottish gubberment to change civil law and make motorists automatically liable in the event of an interaction between motor vehicles and cycles, knowing this lots penchant for doing "pioneering" law adjustments ahead of the rest of the UK I wouldn't be surprised if they jump on board with this one...

Presumed liability

[S2red]

Don't start me on Cyclists

Watched one last week cycle down Pitts st turn left in Sauchiehall st pass between a van and kerb on right hand lane cut across to head into Garnethill all against flow of traffic unreal

Also anyone know rule/guidance for cyclists riding two abreast on main road?

Driving into Kirkintiloch past the Stables 2 guys oblivious to 20 odd cars behind them unable to safely overtake as they would have needed full width of oncoming carriage way then continued into Kikintilloch where the islands on road severely limited a save overtake on opposite side of road

And yes, before all the cyclist complain, I do agree some motorists do have no concept of giving cyclists space.

[mybrainhurts]

This is law in other countries.

Quite apart from the fact that it is outrageous, it would be a magnet for compensation fraudsters.

[Pothole]

S2red said:

Don't start me on Cyclists

Watched one last week cycle down Pitts st turn left in Sauchiehall st pass between a van and kerb on right hand lane cut across to head into Garnethill all against flow of traffic unreal

Also anyone know rule/guidance for cyclists riding two abreast on main road?

Driving into Kirkintiloch past the Stables 2 guys oblivious to 20 odd cars behind them unable to safely overtake as they would have needed full width of oncoming carriage way then continued into Kikintilloch where the islands on road severely limited a save overtake on opposite side of road

And yes, before all the cyclist complain, I do agree some motorists do have no concept of giving cyclists space.

20 cars delayed slightly...did anyone die because of that? Thought not.

Highway Code says:

6.You shouldnever ride more than two abreast, and ride in single file on narrow or busy roads and when riding round bends.

Should, not must.

[jaf01uk]

The potential problem as I see it is that it immediately negates the "innocent until proven guilty" and also surely the cyclists have to take their part in this, some of them already think they are above the law and a classic example round here is the National Cycle Network cycle path that goes through Elgin to Lossiemouth yet some of them decide it's not for them and cycle on the already congested road, come on it cost millions nationwide and you still want to put yourself next to traffic? And before the usual ranters come on it is in perfectly good state of repair with no debris or potholes, got to take some responsibility for their own safety surely?
Gary

[Frenchda]

Pothole said:

S2red said:

Don't start me on Cyclists

Watched one last week cycle down Pitts st turn left in Sauchiehall st pass between a van and kerb on right hand lane cut across to head into Garnethill all against flow of traffic unreal

Also anyone know rule/guidance for cyclists riding two abreast on main road?

Driving into Kirkintiloch past the Stables 2 guys oblivious to 20 odd cars behind them unable to safely overtake as they would have needed full width of oncoming carriage way then continued into Kikintilloch where the islands on road severely limited a save overtake on opposite side of road

And yes, before all the cyclist complain, I do agree some motorists do have no concept of giving cyclists space.

20 cars delayed slightly...did anyone die because of that? Thought not.

Highway Code says:

6.You should?never ride more than two abreast, and ride in single file on narrow or busy roads and when riding round bends.

Should, not must.

Should. Selfish wkers who do this, its not about road position most of the time, its about a nice chat whilst riding. If you want to ride on the road defend your position by all means but don't be a tt. Also every bloody cyclist who chose's to ride on the road should have some sort of liability insurance.
...... I cycle every day to work so am not a hater.

Rant over - back to the question of presumed liability - what a load of tosh, how about each incident is looked at on its own circumstances, daily I see some dreadful driving and equally dreadful cycling.

Edited by Frenchda on Tuesday 7th June 15:30

[S2red]

Yes I concede only delayed 5 mins or so but that could be difference between on time or late for appointment train etc

[mybrainhurts]

Pothole said:

S2red said:

Don't start me on Cyclists

Watched one last week cycle down Pitts st turn left in Sauchiehall st pass between a van and kerb on right hand lane cut across to head into Garnethill all against flow of traffic unreal

Also anyone know rule/guidance for cyclists riding two abreast on main road?

Driving into Kirkintiloch past the Stables 2 guys oblivious to 20 odd cars behind them unable to safely overtake as they would have needed full width of oncoming carriage way then continued into Kikintilloch where the islands on road severely limited a save overtake on opposite side of road

And yes, before all the cyclist complain, I do agree some motorists do have no concept of giving cyclists space.

20 cars delayed slightly...did anyone die because of that? Thought not.

Wild assumption there.

How do you know a frustrated driver didn't cause an accident down the road as a result of his frustration?

[Brads67]

If a slight delay cause him or her to crash due to being frustrated, then they are no loss to the road. Shouldn`t be driving in the first place actually .

Presumed liabilty should at least make sure that NOT hitting a cyclist is their priority.

[mybrainhurts]

Brads67 said:

If a slight delay cause him or her to crash due to being frustrated, then they are no loss to the road. Shouldn`t be driving in the first place actually .

Having received the Statin' The Bleedin' Obvious Award, you will notice they ARE driving on the roads.

Brads67 said:

Presumed liabilty should at least make sure that NOT hitting a cyclist is their priority.

Call me rash, but I think you'd be hard pressed to find anyone whose priority was to hit a cyclist.

But "presumed liability" would be a magnet for compensation fraudsters.

As I mentioned earlier.

[mikecassie]

I'm a motorist and a cyclist and I'm not in agreement with bringing this in. Yes there are some complete cocksockets in cars who pass us cyclists far too closely and all for a few seconds saved on their journey. But having some cocksocket on a bike being a tt because he feels he is 'in the right' isn't good for how we are viewed by other road users, as can be seen by some comments here.
Let us keep the 'innocent until proven guilty' ruling for everyone. Please Sturgeon, just see some fking sense for once and don't jump on this bandwagon.

[Brads67]

mybrainhurts said:

Brads67 said:

If a slight delay cause him or her to crash due to being frustrated, then they are no loss to the road. Shouldn`t be driving in the first place actually .

Having received the Statin' The Bleedin' Obvious Award, you will notice they ARE driving on the roads.



I have no idea what that means !

Brads67 said:

Presumed liabilty should at least make sure that NOT hitting a cyclist is their priority.

Call me rash, but I think you'd be hard pressed to find anyone whose priority was to hit a cyclist.

But "presumed liability" would be a magnet for compensation fraudsters.

As I mentioned earlier.

I`ve come across plenty who use cars to threaten cyclists , so it would seem to me that not hitting me is NOT their priority.

[GoneAnon]

Coming round a blind bend to find a pack of bicyclists racing, with two of them on the wrong side of the road gave ME a fright - they just seemed angry that I was driving within a safe speed on MY side of the road.

If I had hit one or both of them, with no camera on board my car and no other witnesses, how many of the survivors would need to say I came tearing round the bend on THEIR side of the road before I found myself in trouble?

Maybe insurance companies should/will provide free cameras for all policy-holders?

[Pothole]

mybrainhurts said:

Pothole said:

S2red said:

Don't start me on Cyclists

Watched one last week cycle down Pitts st turn left in Sauchiehall st pass between a van and kerb on right hand lane cut across to head into Garnethill all against flow of traffic unreal

Also anyone know rule/guidance for cyclists riding two abreast on main road?

Driving into Kirkintiloch past the Stables 2 guys oblivious to 20 odd cars behind them unable to safely overtake as they would have needed full width of oncoming carriage way then continued into Kikintilloch where the islands on road severely limited a save overtake on opposite side of road

And yes, before all the cyclist complain, I do agree some motorists do have no concept of giving cyclists space.

20 cars delayed slightly...did anyone die because of that? Thought not.

Wild assumption there.

How do you know a frustrated driver didn't cause an accident down the road as a result of his frustration?

That would be entirely his fault, not the cyclists'. FAr too many road users appear to believe that their "rights" override or supercede anyone else's. Utterly ridiculous attitudes abound. If EVERYONE just calmed down and adopted a more live and let live approach, EVERYONE would benefit. Sadly, very few appear capable.

[AmiableChimp]

mikecassie said:

I'm a motorist and a cyclist and I'm not in agreement with bringing this in. Yes there are some complete cocksockets in cars who pass us cyclists far too closely and all for a few seconds saved on their journey. But having some cocksocket on a bike being a tt because he feels he is 'in the right' isn't good for how we are viewed by other road users, as can be seen by some comments here.
Let us keep the 'innocent until proven guilty' ruling for everyone. Please Sturgeon, just see some fking sense for once and don't jump on this bandwagon.

Absolutely agree (i'm both a driver and cyclist and try to be courteous to other road users regardless of which mode of transport I am using).