M60 Congestion Tax - The coup d'etat on BBC NW...
Discussion
On the local news last night, it was reported that following the polling of 6,000 Mancunians, 53% support this insidious tax, so long as that wilfully, disingenuously presented as transport's eternal panacea - public sodding transport - benefitted from the receipts...
Now forgive me if I don't replicate a cartwheeling jester on acid at this juncture but once again, it seems that the genuine desires of the millions against this latest round of scandalous, leftist economic sabotage, are being brutally rode over.
The piece even suggested that over 40% of businesses were in favour? Really? What businesses might these be, besides the possible operators? Astonishing propoganda.
Fair play to the liberal councillor who was asking for a referrendum, although naturally, it will never happen because as with any substantial issues of the day - like European asimilation at the hands of vino quoffing communists - the intelligentsia who are in power, destroying Britain - know they would be fatally exposed.
The absolute w
rs, I hope the architects of this madness are collectively reaped this very night. 
Now forgive me if I don't replicate a cartwheeling jester on acid at this juncture but once again, it seems that the genuine desires of the millions against this latest round of scandalous, leftist economic sabotage, are being brutally rode over.
The piece even suggested that over 40% of businesses were in favour? Really? What businesses might these be, besides the possible operators? Astonishing propoganda.
Fair play to the liberal councillor who was asking for a referrendum, although naturally, it will never happen because as with any substantial issues of the day - like European asimilation at the hands of vino quoffing communists - the intelligentsia who are in power, destroying Britain - know they would be fatally exposed.
The absolute w
rs, I hope the architects of this madness are collectively reaped this very night. 
According to statistics the average man has less than two boI heard this also, funny as it flys in the face of what EVERYONE I have spoken too have said, I would love to know who they polled and if they let them know we have to repay 66% of the loan?
I am sick and tired of this country being thrown to the dogs by people using tax as fines to line their pockets and cover up the mis management they have done. Between the do gooders and the politicians the country will be destroyed in our lifetime.
Bring on the revolution.
I am sick and tired of this country being thrown to the dogs by people using tax as fines to line their pockets and cover up the mis management they have done. Between the do gooders and the politicians the country will be destroyed in our lifetime.
Bring on the revolution.
derestrictor said:
On the local news last night, it was reported that following the polling of 6,000 Mancunians, 53% support this insidious tax, so long as that wilfully, disingenuously presented as transport's eternal panacea - public sodding transport - benefitted from the receipts...
Now forgive me if I don't replicate a cartwheeling jester on acid at this juncture but once again, it seems that the genuine desires of the millions against this latest round of scandalous, leftist economic sabotage, are being brutally rode over.
The piece even suggested that over 40% of businesses were in favour? Really? What businesses might these be, besides the possible operators? Astonishing propoganda.
Fair play to the liberal councillor who was asking for a referrendum, although naturally, it will never happen because as with any substantial issues of the day - like European asimilation at the hands of vino quoffing communists - the intelligentsia who are in power, destroying Britain - know they would be fatally exposed.
The absolute wrs, I hope the architects of this madness are collectively reaped this very night.
If over 40% of businesses polled were pro then shirley that's just weasel words for 'over 50% of businesses were against'?Now forgive me if I don't replicate a cartwheeling jester on acid at this juncture but once again, it seems that the genuine desires of the millions against this latest round of scandalous, leftist economic sabotage, are being brutally rode over.
The piece even suggested that over 40% of businesses were in favour? Really? What businesses might these be, besides the possible operators? Astonishing propoganda.
Fair play to the liberal councillor who was asking for a referrendum, although naturally, it will never happen because as with any substantial issues of the day - like European asimilation at the hands of vino quoffing communists - the intelligentsia who are in power, destroying Britain - know they would be fatally exposed.
The absolute w
rs, I hope the architects of this madness are collectively reaped this very night. Has anyone ever thought about the true downsides?
IE creation of the overseeing administration. Confusion. Inconvenience for those that are infrequent users (like myself). I drive into town about once a month. I'm easily confused as it stands. I would have an overwhelming desire to not be confused and just stay away - losing my cash input into the city centre.
We have a commuter tax already....a combination of time wasted and fuel used. I have worked in the city and, even as a die hard car driver, couldn't justify taking my car in...the time taken was about equal but the costs were lower when you take parking (finding a spot and costs) into the equation. It made sense to join the unwashed on the buses.
Isn't that the problem? If the car is the better solution then you'll take the car. Public transport is so dire that it doesn't make sense otherwise we'd bleeding well use it!
QED no tax required. We'll abandon the car when there is a viable alternative.
planetdave said:
derestrictor said:
On the local news last night, it was reported that following the polling of 6,000 Mancunians, 53% support this insidious tax, so long as that wilfully, disingenuously presented as transport's eternal panacea - public sodding transport - benefitted from the receipts...
Now forgive me if I don't replicate a cartwheeling jester on acid at this juncture but once again, it seems that the genuine desires of the millions against this latest round of scandalous, leftist economic sabotage, are being brutally rode over.
The piece even suggested that over 40% of businesses were in favour? Really? What businesses might these be, besides the possible operators? Astonishing propoganda.
Fair play to the liberal councillor who was asking for a referrendum, although naturally, it will never happen because as with any substantial issues of the day - like European asimilation at the hands of vino quoffing communists - the intelligentsia who are in power, destroying Britain - know they would be fatally exposed.
The absolute wrs, I hope the architects of this madness are collectively reaped this very night.
If over 40% of businesses polled were pro then shirley that's just weasel words for 'over 50% of businesses were against'?Now forgive me if I don't replicate a cartwheeling jester on acid at this juncture but once again, it seems that the genuine desires of the millions against this latest round of scandalous, leftist economic sabotage, are being brutally rode over.
The piece even suggested that over 40% of businesses were in favour? Really? What businesses might these be, besides the possible operators? Astonishing propoganda.
Fair play to the liberal councillor who was asking for a referrendum, although naturally, it will never happen because as with any substantial issues of the day - like European asimilation at the hands of vino quoffing communists - the intelligentsia who are in power, destroying Britain - know they would be fatally exposed.
The absolute w
rs, I hope the architects of this madness are collectively reaped this very night. Has anyone ever thought about the true downsides?
IE creation of the overseeing administration. Confusion. Inconvenience for those that are infrequent users (like myself). I drive into town about once a month. I'm easily confused as it stands. I would have an overwhelming desire to not be confused and just stay away - losing my cash input into the city centre.
We have a commuter tax already....a combination of time wasted and fuel used. I have worked in the city and, even as a die hard car driver, couldn't justify taking my car in...the time taken was about equal but the costs were lower when you take parking (finding a spot and costs) into the equation. It made sense to join the unwashed on the buses.
Isn't that the problem? If the car is the better solution then you'll take the car. Public transport is so dire that it doesn't make sense otherwise we'd bleeding well use it!
QED no tax required. We'll abandon the car when there is a viable alternative.
well said that man.planetdave said:
Isn't that the problem? If the car is the better solution then you'll take the car. Public transport is so dire that it doesn't make sense otherwise we'd bleeding well use it!
QED no tax required. We'll abandon the car when there is a viable alternative.
I'm not convinced it's that simple. When I visited Sydney about 9 years ago, I was amazed at how cheap the public transport was: it cost about a fiver for a week's travel on buses, trains and ferries. There were plenty of each, they were clean and they were pretty much on time. I had no problem getting around to the places I wanted to go. And yet... they were mostly empty, whilst the roads around the city were clogged up with single-occupant cars.QED no tax required. We'll abandon the car when there is a viable alternative.
You do have a point there Major. But you nicely side-stepped, by selective quoting, that I will and have used public transport to access the city when it made sense. The prices were reasonable and the timetable handy and it meant I didn't have to scrabble around trying to find an all day parking spot for big money.
But if I can run with your point that cheap and good public transport is not as inviting as your own car.
Damn right. I'll pay a hefty premium to use my car. A-B..weather proof/no unpleasant smells and mine own music. Nice place to be.
Which is the problem you identify. They keep taxing cars to high heaven in myriad ways and STILL we keep using them over a cheaper alternative.
When I used the bus it was because I just couldn't justify car use over the bus that I actively hated. More taxes dont work - when fuel goes up you grumble and maybe drive a bit slower for a while but you still splash it in. A congestion charge is pretty similar. Some people will weigh it up and find the economics of public transport outweigh the car benefit...but I'll bet anything that if you can drive there in a reasonable time and park either end that you'll keep on doing it.
I stand by my arguement that it's the time factor that really matters - more congestion will regulate itself by people not wanting to waste their time in traffic jams.
On the other side the fools in power see a chance to expand their empires with more regulation and staff to administer it. And something to put on their CV ie I made a major city move onto public transport and here are my statistics to prove it. I think the motives are grandiose and Stalinist and contrary to our needs. Our infrastructure is late 20th century and geared for car.
We'd need to change our lifestyles back to what we had in the 60's to make public transport work. I can't see that going down well with the voters.
But if I can run with your point that cheap and good public transport is not as inviting as your own car.
Damn right. I'll pay a hefty premium to use my car. A-B..weather proof/no unpleasant smells and mine own music. Nice place to be.
Which is the problem you identify. They keep taxing cars to high heaven in myriad ways and STILL we keep using them over a cheaper alternative.
When I used the bus it was because I just couldn't justify car use over the bus that I actively hated. More taxes dont work - when fuel goes up you grumble and maybe drive a bit slower for a while but you still splash it in. A congestion charge is pretty similar. Some people will weigh it up and find the economics of public transport outweigh the car benefit...but I'll bet anything that if you can drive there in a reasonable time and park either end that you'll keep on doing it.
I stand by my arguement that it's the time factor that really matters - more congestion will regulate itself by people not wanting to waste their time in traffic jams.
On the other side the fools in power see a chance to expand their empires with more regulation and staff to administer it. And something to put on their CV ie I made a major city move onto public transport and here are my statistics to prove it. I think the motives are grandiose and Stalinist and contrary to our needs. Our infrastructure is late 20th century and geared for car.
We'd need to change our lifestyles back to what we had in the 60's to make public transport work. I can't see that going down well with the voters.
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