20 MPH blanket limit in Bristol
Discussion
20mph is rediculous.
If they want to make it safer for cyclists etc... then they shouldn't have built 'pinch-points' all the way along Whiteladies road where they built out bus-stops and put in central 'islands' so that cyclists and cars have to battle each other for space each time they are forced to squeeze through these spaces all the way along here.
And what is the idea behind building out bus stops so much that following cars have to pull out into oncoming traffic to avoid getting stuck behind a bus for 10 mins while poor people who can't afford cars, climb aboard said bus?
Not only stupid - just plain dangerous.
If they want to make it safer for cyclists etc... then they shouldn't have built 'pinch-points' all the way along Whiteladies road where they built out bus-stops and put in central 'islands' so that cyclists and cars have to battle each other for space each time they are forced to squeeze through these spaces all the way along here.
And what is the idea behind building out bus stops so much that following cars have to pull out into oncoming traffic to avoid getting stuck behind a bus for 10 mins while poor people who can't afford cars, climb aboard said bus?
Not only stupid - just plain dangerous.
Its all part of the wider picture... blocking off side roads (relief roads) to force everyone down the same road to hit the same junction to cause congestion. Busses stop in the middle of the road to prevent cars getting past to cause congestion. Traffic lights at every roundabout to make people stop thus causing congestion.
Then they will have the excuse to charge us for entering these 'council inflicted congestion zones'.
Also this should work both ways. If they are going to enforce a 20mph limit & fine drivers for going over it then we should have a rebate or money back if we are unable to drive at a steady 20mph through the city.
I read the average speed in Bristol is one of the lowest in the country outside London, I think its 17 mph so enforcing a 20mph limit is pointless, the congested roads already mean its impossible to do 20 mph anyway.
Then they will have the excuse to charge us for entering these 'council inflicted congestion zones'.
Also this should work both ways. If they are going to enforce a 20mph limit & fine drivers for going over it then we should have a rebate or money back if we are unable to drive at a steady 20mph through the city.
I read the average speed in Bristol is one of the lowest in the country outside London, I think its 17 mph so enforcing a 20mph limit is pointless, the congested roads already mean its impossible to do 20 mph anyway.
As someone who is visiting Bristol much more frequently now, this makes for interesting reading.
The article mentions about Portsmouth having the same scheme. They started it in 2006 and an "Interim Evaluation" was published later in 2009 to some very mixed reponses. I admit I am coming from a biased point of view, but the best argument does seem to be that the statistics from the report have been cherry picked to imply it is working. Despite only two years worth of data.
The main article against appears to be from the Telegraph HERE.
This link HERE gives a brief report from both sides, links the Council's report from it (as well as the Telegraph's) and the interim evaluation itself. Some interesting user comments too.
As far as I can see there has been no evaluation since then to give some more concrete data either way.
Have a Google of "Portsmouth 20 mph" for various other bits.
As far as I can tell it seems an ineffective scheme and one that doesn't add up. I think the thing that irritates me most is the constant theme of "speed kills" being the message behind these.
The article mentions about Portsmouth having the same scheme. They started it in 2006 and an "Interim Evaluation" was published later in 2009 to some very mixed reponses. I admit I am coming from a biased point of view, but the best argument does seem to be that the statistics from the report have been cherry picked to imply it is working. Despite only two years worth of data.
The main article against appears to be from the Telegraph HERE.
This link HERE gives a brief report from both sides, links the Council's report from it (as well as the Telegraph's) and the interim evaluation itself. Some interesting user comments too.
As far as I can see there has been no evaluation since then to give some more concrete data either way.
Have a Google of "Portsmouth 20 mph" for various other bits.
As far as I can tell it seems an ineffective scheme and one that doesn't add up. I think the thing that irritates me most is the constant theme of "speed kills" being the message behind these.
THINK OF THE CHILDREN!!!
FFS I live in Bristol just, about 1/2 from south glos and hope they don't do this soon and think this is balls, the traffic calming schemes are b
ks, they block roads and make other areas have big traffic jams because of this.
as for my "think of the children" adults and kids need to look when crossing the road as daily i'm having to watch people walk out in front of me because they don't fking look before crossing !!!! sorry gets on my tits
FFS I live in Bristol just, about 1/2 from south glos and hope they don't do this soon and think this is balls, the traffic calming schemes are b
ks, they block roads and make other areas have big traffic jams because of this. as for my "think of the children" adults and kids need to look when crossing the road as daily i'm having to watch people walk out in front of me because they don't f
king look before crossing !!!! sorry gets on my tits RemaL said:
THINK OF THE CHILDREN!!!
FFS I live in Bristol just, about 1/2 from south glos and hope they don't do this soon and think this is balls, the traffic calming schemes are bks, they block roads and make other areas have big traffic jams because of this.
as for my "think of the children" adults and kids need to look when crossing the road as daily i'm having to watch people walk out in front of me because they don't fking look before crossing !!!! sorry gets on my tits
Dont beat about the bush just tell us what you think FFS I live in Bristol just, about 1/2 from south glos and hope they don't do this soon and think this is balls, the traffic calming schemes are b
ks, they block roads and make other areas have big traffic jams because of this. as for my "think of the children" adults and kids need to look when crossing the road as daily i'm having to watch people walk out in front of me because they don't f
king look before crossing !!!! sorry gets on my tits 
splodge s4 said:
RemaL said:
THINK OF THE CHILDREN!!!
FFS I live in Bristol just, about 1/2 from south glos and hope they don't do this soon and think this is balls, the traffic calming schemes are bks, they block roads and make other areas have big traffic jams because of this.
as for my "think of the children" adults and kids need to look when crossing the road as daily i'm having to watch people walk out in front of me because they don't fking look before crossing !!!! sorry gets on my tits
Dont beat about the bush just tell us what you think FFS I live in Bristol just, about 1/2 from south glos and hope they don't do this soon and think this is balls, the traffic calming schemes are b
ks, they block roads and make other areas have big traffic jams because of this. as for my "think of the children" adults and kids need to look when crossing the road as daily i'm having to watch people walk out in front of me because they don't f
king look before crossing !!!! sorry gets on my tits putting bus lanes out in the road making it more difficult to pass stopped buses.
it won't stop people walking out in front of cars just make it easier to get ££££ from people doing 27MPH in the possible 20 new limits and give us a fine.
given the state of the roads and the reluctance tto do any repairs, and the fact that there are so many cars in and around the city between 7099-0900 and 1600-1800, no one can go exceed 20mph anyway?!
as for making things safer, not installing cobbles at the bottom of park street and around infront of the hippodrome would have helped! bristol city council is a puppet for the first bus group, always has been, always will be....
as for making things safer, not installing cobbles at the bottom of park street and around infront of the hippodrome would have helped! bristol city council is a puppet for the first bus group, always has been, always will be....
Ok, I understand a 20mph limit around schools but as for the rest of Bristol..........................well it just beggars belief! One of the councilers were on the telly tonight explaining the decision.............there were a lot of bicycles in the background................was there a hidden message in their somewhere?
Smartboy said:
If they want to make it safer for cyclists etc... then they shouldn't have built 'pinch-points' all the way along Whiteladies road where they built out bus-stops and put in central 'islands' so that cyclists and cars have to battle each other for space each time they are forced to squeeze through these spaces all the way along here.
And what is the idea behind building out bus stops so much that following cars have to pull out into oncoming traffic to avoid getting stuck behind a bus for 10 mins while poor people who can't afford cars, climb aboard said bus?
Not only stupid - just plain dangerous.
Don't get me started on what they've done here. As a driver, cyclists and bus passenger alike, Bristol City Council have comprehensively hindered movements of all forms of transport. There seems to be no consistency to the development, with pinch points seemingly followed by dual-lane boulevard. All this means cars get stuck behind buses, so following buses get stuck behind the aforementioned cars, slowing down all road users. The cycle lanes stop and start for no apparent reason, while the pinch points force cyclists either on to the pavement or into oncoming traffic. An absolute disaster, which no doubt cost the taxpayer hundreds of thousands of pounds at the very least. Of course, the only winners is all this are the contractors, who'll be re-employed to repair the whole mess in a few years time. And what is the idea behind building out bus stops so much that following cars have to pull out into oncoming traffic to avoid getting stuck behind a bus for 10 mins while poor people who can't afford cars, climb aboard said bus?
Not only stupid - just plain dangerous.
I don't have a problem with 20mph limits on purely residential streets - the kind that don't carry through traffic. An artificially low limit on other roads will be ignored though, and is it a good idea to have a law that you don't expect people to obey?
Interesting spin on the results from the two trial areas from the Councillor, despite there being more casualties overall than before. The 'small but important' reduction in speeds is actually a whopping 1mph if my information is correct - not a great reflection on a 10mph limit reduction, and presumably the vast majority of motorists are now breaking the law (and risking the associated penalties).
Interesting spin on the results from the two trial areas from the Councillor, despite there being more casualties overall than before. The 'small but important' reduction in speeds is actually a whopping 1mph if my information is correct - not a great reflection on a 10mph limit reduction, and presumably the vast majority of motorists are now breaking the law (and risking the associated penalties).
Edited by S. Gonzales Esq. on Thursday 8th March 23:13
I have no problem with 20mph on purely residential roads, the problem is that many of the through routes are residential roads and here is where the problem will be. The council has always had an agenda against the individual who wants to use a car in Bristol. They have tried parking restrictions, altering the roads so it is difficult to get where you want to go and now this. the final bit they want to implement is work place parking charges or as most sensible people see a tax on jobs and low paid workers.
Lunatics will not be satisfied until only public transport is allowed.
Lunatics will not be satisfied until only public transport is allowed.
choptop said:
Ok, I understand a 20mph limit around schools but as for the rest of Bristol..........................well it just beggars belief! One of the councilers were on the telly tonight explaining the decision.............there were a lot of bicycles in the background................was there a hidden message in their somewhere?
probably but trust me as a cyclist i think its a stupid idea. i can average 20mph on a bike easily enough in town and the problem then is that cars either have to break the speed limit to get past or stick behind me and they get angry an inch off my rear wheel. i would much rather cars came past at 30 and didnt risk a speeding ticket because i know they will blame the cyclist for holding them up if they are caught!
a 20mph limit will only increase the anti-cyclist mentality amongst Bristolian drivers...
Bristol does have a traffic problem during peak times.
When they developed the area arond Temple Meads, why on earth didn't they put a bus terminal there as well... linking rail and bus together. Seems a sensible idea to me, but instead they re-developed the city centre bus station.
I have given up trying to drive into town every day. Sitting in traffic for an hour each way in my RS6 isn't too good for the fuel comsumption, so I now commute on my bike.... and that's another thing, why do so many cyclists insist in completely ignoring the rules of the road.
I was sitting at a red light at the top of Park St the other morning and watched as a cyclist went past me, through the read light and directly into the path of a Transit Van! Although I don't want to see anybody hurt - he blatantly bought this on himself.
Oh well - sort of proves Darwin's theory of evolution. The weak / stupid don't last long enough to reproduce (no - the cyclist didn't die, just had a big old smash).
When they developed the area arond Temple Meads, why on earth didn't they put a bus terminal there as well... linking rail and bus together. Seems a sensible idea to me, but instead they re-developed the city centre bus station.
I have given up trying to drive into town every day. Sitting in traffic for an hour each way in my RS6 isn't too good for the fuel comsumption, so I now commute on my bike.... and that's another thing, why do so many cyclists insist in completely ignoring the rules of the road.
I was sitting at a red light at the top of Park St the other morning and watched as a cyclist went past me, through the read light and directly into the path of a Transit Van! Although I don't want to see anybody hurt - he blatantly bought this on himself.
Oh well - sort of proves Darwin's theory of evolution. The weak / stupid don't last long enough to reproduce (no - the cyclist didn't die, just had a big old smash).
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