engine diagnostic help please!

[greymrj]

First the good news, took it for an MOT today. Bearing in mind that it hasn't been on the road for 5 years, most of it has been apart, and it hasn't had any 'shake down' I had warned the tester that it might nor even get there! He was interested in the car and did as I asked and gave it a very thorough check indeed. It failed on two very minor issues; an intermittent fault on the wiper cancelling and a front side light bulb failed (between my drive last night and the MOT station!) BUT as I was turning into the MOT centre (2 miles from home and the engine was only just getting fully warm) it started to stutter and died. After a few minutes it started and drove onto the ramps. The problem then was that during the emissions test it wouldn't run cleanly long enough to get a result. It would fire up and run OK and the CO and C02 counts and hydrocarbon counts were OK, then it would start to stutter, the hydrocarbon count went up and the engine died.
On the way home it died about 6 times. It felt exactly like it was running out of fuel (and the tester did think the emission issue could be because it would start to run weak rather than rich). Leave everything switched off for a few minutes and it started on the button then did it again a few hundred yards later.
Possibilities?
I'd only put 2 gallon in the tank before I set off.
First of all I checked to see if fuel was coming through OK. Seems to be coming out of the new filter under adequate pressure but I have noticed that I can hear the pump running virtually all the time. I've taken the connectors off the pump and accumulator/regulator and the fuel seem to be coming through OK.
It shouldn't be a hot coil failure as it had a new coil (and new distributor and cap etc)and anyway it was ticking over perfectly well for long period under test at home.
Problem now is that I am running out of time for S club, I need to get it through the MOT and a decent shakedown run done before going as far as Newark, so can anybody out there save me time by suggesting the obvious things that I should have checked!

[Barkychoc]

Have you put more fuel in the tank?
By the time you've filled the filter, primed everything and its running cold so its thirsty as hell do you think you could be short of fuel?
Only a guess.

C

[kenpage]

richard,chis could have a point there when i started mine up for the first time i only put 1 gallon in and it went in no time and that was in the garage...as the car has been sitting a while is there rust/debris in the tank and blocking the filter in the bottom of the tank....if the pump is running all the time its got to be lack of fuel due to a restriction or an air leak on a fuel pipe...ps if the s1 is the same as a s2 have you got the supply and return pipes the right way round just a silly thought really but i nearly did it

Edited by kenpage on Monday 9th June 21:03

[greymrj]

I do take your point both of you, and thanks. There does seem to be enough fuel coming through but what with filling the system and the running the engine has had since it went in it could be running low. I will certainly be going out for a couple of gallon more just in case!

[Barkychoc]

I remember now Ray S telling me that it took him ages to figure out he had the feed and return hoses the wrong way round on his S1 - and he had symptoms pretty similar to yours.

Chris

Edited by Barkychoc on Monday 9th June 21:20

[james280779]

hi Richard, if thats my old engine make sure the cold start system Is disconnected, the blue connector above the alternator, I had major issues with it running when I first got it, had it analysised - disconnected the blue thing then ran it problem free for 4 years.

Hope thats the problem , James

[jimed]

Sorry to hear about the problem Richard - so near and yet so far - so hope it is all OK for next weekend.
Jim
PS If its not let me know as I will probably have a spare seat to S Club on Sunday am

[greymrj]

Still puzzled, got back in time to have another look this evening. Plenty of fuel now and I have taken off each component in the fuel supply and there seems to be plenty of pressure right through to the Jetronic fuel distributor unit. Its isn't the cold start relay James as I fitted all the ancillaries from my previous engine. I did try it without the relay but to no effect. Tomorrow night it is back to basics and to work my way through the ignition side and all the sensors/relays!
Incidentally the faulty wiper action did prove to be a motor fault (a broken brush was the main cause but the motor proved to be in pretty dubious condition anyway). Next issue, what on earth is the motor source. All the stickers are gone but the case is stamped DELCO (i.e. AC Delco), and it appeared to be original to the car (it is an '88 car). It is of the4 drank and rod type rather than the spiral wire type shown in 'Heath'. Again my factor friend came up trumps, almost certainly as used on some Vauxhalls and put me in touch with a friendly Vauxhall dealer, their spares guy took some trouble and found a motor which appears to match in every important respect.......Astra, right up to the last but one model! He knew I wanted to try a breakers first (just as well as they are £108+vat each!) and I will do so at the weekend and report back.

[Gerald-TVR]

Richard

I believe Adrian Venn - Exactly TVR has replacement wiper motors

[CTE]

Another thing to check with the 2.8i engines is to look for air leaks on the intake system (soapy water around joints in the pipework etc). Any drop in pressure alters the vacuum to the fuel control valve, thereby messing up the fuel flow.

[greymrj]

Got back on to it at the weekend, checked, double checked, replaced everything I could, still not right. Called out a friend who has a tuning business, he did loads of tests, still not right! Engine is fine but the ignition is not. He described it as 'a right migraine job this'! It might be an obscure and irregular fault on the ignition module (the alloy box above the near side inner wing) but we are not convinced. Trying to source one to substitute to try...but S Club is getting closer and time is really running out now.
Oh, sorted the wipers, I'll do a post on that as it may help others at some time. So I can now sit in a stationary car listening to the stereo and watching the wipers work......how satisfying *!*!*!

[greymrj]

Thought I ought to report back, may help someone at some time. If any of you have ever been chasing two interlinked problems at the same time you will sympathise with me! Engine was running, a bit lumpy but had been running some time on tickover, enough for the fan to have cut in a few times. Then it started to die, fortunately the strobe was still connected and we just happened to notice that the strobe flash became intermittent! We ran what was effectively a duplicate ignition wiring system to make sure it wasnt a connection fault and that showed it had to be the ignition module. It appears that the engine ignition module was starting to fail as the heat built up under the bonnet. Cool the car and it works again! Apparently they do not normally fail that way. So, fit the new module and all is well? Oh no, not quite that simple. Engine fires and runs fine on tick over, and will rev pretty cleanly, but sustained revs or load on the road and it dies again! *!*!*!. I remembered some language that I should have forgotten! Still kept coming back to me that this was fuel starvation. Pump appeared to be working fine but this time we connected a pressure meter. Guess what; the pump worked up to pressure then (presumably as the pump gets warm) the pressure dropped away a fair bit! As the Borsch Jetronic is sensitive to incoming fuel pressure the car dies. So obtain and fit new fuel pump (found a good source and will post) to replace what appeared to be a pretty new one anyway. Pressure shoots up and stays up, all is well! (at least it is at the moment!)

[kenpage]

well done see you at sch then