S3 / S3Cat

[germantvr]

Hi mates,
the engine with cat is quoted with around 20nm more torque.
Any experience with both engines, whether this is only written in the book or is there a real difference?
Is the Cat Version more agile? You feel more Power? Or is it only a joke??

What is the real output of these engines?

Thanks for sharing your knowledge and experience
Regards
Reinhard

[lordofthewings]

germantvr said:

Any experience with both engines...

Here are some thoughts on the S's that I have owned, in chronological order:

S3C bought new in 1990, so it drove like a new car should, the engine on mine was blueprinted and I liked both the performance and the smell when I started it !
S1, bought in c.1995, little difference in performance but I liked the handling and it felt more agile than some other S's.
S3, bought (and sold) in early 2004, I liked the drive but not the doubtful provenance that I uncovered.
V8S, bought in late 2004 and way more powerful and a different driving experience than the V6 cars, it is currently owned by another PH'er and it's the S that I would choose if I could have just one.
S3, current car, bought from another PH'er and I'm perfectly happy with the performance, and the engine is set-up and sounds just the way I like them.

Not sure if that helps, but other PH'ers are bound to have views to contribute.

[germantvr]

Is there any difference you can feel between the engines?

[lordofthewings]

Well apart from the power and torque of the V8..... I only owned that new S3C for a few months before I got a company car, so it was barely run-in, and sadly the new owner wrote it off that winter. I can't recall any real difference from my current or previous S3. I do recall the 2.8 seemed to "rev" very freely, maybe a bit down on power compared to the 2.9.

[Kitchski]

Having driven loads of different S', the biggest differences I've found with the 'C' over the normal S3:

• Exhaust is noticeably quieter.
• Induction sounds slightly louder (no air flow meters, so filters can be a bit more 'vocal'....possibly? Or just that the engine isn't being drowned out by the exhaust?!)
• Because exhaust is quieter, you can hear the engine's mechanical chatter a bit more.
• Feels a tiny bit less eager performance-wise, though there's little in it.

[TVR-Stu]

Kitchski said:

Having driven loads of different S', the biggest differences I've found with the 'C' over the normal S3:

• Exhaust is noticeably quieter.
• Induction sounds slightly louder (no air flow meters, so filters can be a bit more 'vocal'....possibly? Or just that the engine isn't being drowned out by the exhaust?!)
• Because exhaust is quieter, you can hear the engine's mechanical chatter a bit more.
• Feels a tiny bit less eager performance-wise, though there's little in it.

Presumably you are talking about 'C' cars that still have the cats in place? Any experience of a difference with cars that have had the cats removed? I was under the impression there was a bit more torque available in these later engines?

[AutoAndy]

Hi, i think with cars this age, then it depends on condition more than model.
Official power was 170bhp cant remember the torque....
I have an S3C cat car, but with cats removed.
I had it tested a couple of years ago on a rolling road and it had power of 164bhp and torque of 165.8 lbf (sorry for imperial units)
... but....
I had the injectors cleaned and put on a new manifold (standard design but better made for airflow etc). I then had it tested on the same rolling road and power increased to 181.3 and the torque increased to 182.9

So I don’t think model matters less than condition ... and I am not sure you will notice the difference.

... it also depends on how heavy your right foot is .... and if you want to beat a V8... then it is how fast you exit the corner whilst the V8 is being careful not to spin with too much torque

[Kitchski]

TVR-Stu said:

Presumably you are talking about 'C' cars that still have the cats in place? Any experience of a difference with cars that have had the cats removed? I was under the impression there was a bit more torque available in these later engines?

I was, but a decatted car doesn't feel much different. Louder, though!

To be honest, I really wouldn't worry. All Cologne V6s feel asthmatic, whether it's the 2.8 or 2.9; cat or no-cat etc. There's no sudden rush of power, nor is there a gutful of low-down torque. They're simple, make the right noises, are pretty tough and do the job. Honestly, I could go from a 2.8 with 130bhp (real world) to a 2.9 with 165bhp (real world) and they really don't feel much different. There are many other aspects you notice before the speed.

Go to a V8, and everything changes