Discussion
I know there have been postings on this subject before but I can never seem to find the search facility working, so can anybody point me the right way.
My tank is now 24 years old (no ceremony will be held!). For at least 4 years before I bought the car as a non runner it was laid up with an empty tank. Not surprisingly rust has been a problem. I have had the tank out and cleaned it...twice. I have also fitted a very high spec full flow filter upstream of the pump (a Demon Tweeks item with removable elements), that works very well, so well that it is virtually full every 500miles! Reluctantly I have to face defeat and start saving the pension towards a new tank.
I don't particularly want to fork out for a stainless or alloy tank, a well made and well epoxy coated steel tank will last me out! I think I know where I can get one made but before I do I would welcome the benefit of any experience gained by other S owners.
Anybody have a firm they would definitely recommend?
Anybody have an old tank I can borrow as a template so my car can stay on the road?
I think the fuel gauge sender is fundamentally badly positioned and should be as high as access allows, any thoughts?
The swirl pot in the tank is pretty useless but ensures the outlet is situated where there is likely to be the most c--p! There is little effective baffling inside the tank so more baffles and a conventional outlet above the tank floor would be better, any thoughts?
My tank is now 24 years old (no ceremony will be held!). For at least 4 years before I bought the car as a non runner it was laid up with an empty tank. Not surprisingly rust has been a problem. I have had the tank out and cleaned it...twice. I have also fitted a very high spec full flow filter upstream of the pump (a Demon Tweeks item with removable elements), that works very well, so well that it is virtually full every 500miles! Reluctantly I have to face defeat and start saving the pension towards a new tank.
I don't particularly want to fork out for a stainless or alloy tank, a well made and well epoxy coated steel tank will last me out! I think I know where I can get one made but before I do I would welcome the benefit of any experience gained by other S owners.
Anybody have a firm they would definitely recommend?
Anybody have an old tank I can borrow as a template so my car can stay on the road?
I think the fuel gauge sender is fundamentally badly positioned and should be as high as access allows, any thoughts?
The swirl pot in the tank is pretty useless but ensures the outlet is situated where there is likely to be the most c--p! There is little effective baffling inside the tank so more baffles and a conventional outlet above the tank floor would be better, any thoughts?
Steve Reid (the gamekeeper on here) had a tank off me some while ago to act as a pattern for Stainlees replacements, you might be able to borrow.
As to the swirl pot I believe the idea was to maintaine fuel flow during cornering by creating a low point which restricted fuel 'slosh'. if you do away with it then i think you would have to create industrial strength baffling
As to the swirl pot I believe the idea was to maintaine fuel flow during cornering by creating a low point which restricted fuel 'slosh'. if you do away with it then i think you would have to create industrial strength baffling
Thanks Norman, but come on guys help me, surely there is more info out there than that! Anybody able to locate the previous threads or add to the info?...I have tried many times but the 'search' function is always 'under maintenance'. Getting frustrated....the information is on Pistonheads, or in the brains of Pistonhead members, I just cant get to it at the moment.
Hi All.
I know this has been done by one of the members.
http://www.frost.co.uk/automotive-tanks-products/p...
As you say search is down so don't know who it was.
Alan
I know this has been done by one of the members.
http://www.frost.co.uk/automotive-tanks-products/p...
As you say search is down so don't know who it was.
Alan
Why not have another one made up in mild steel as it will be cheaper than stainless or alloy and should last another 20 years or so? Should be a fairly straight-forward job for any decent fabricator. If you were prepared to cut an access panel into either the shelf in the boot (or the parcel shelf and hide it under the carpet) you could mount the sender unit on top of the tank. EG
http://www.cbsonline.co.uk/product/Fuel_Tank_Sende...
http://www.cbsonline.co.uk/product/Fuel_Tank_Sende...
Sure, stainless will look great and last for ever, but will the car. Will you own it for ever? In 20 years time will you be kicking yourself for fitting a mild steel one?
If you can find someone to do this job reliably, for a decent price, he might get a few more orders.
http://www.cbsonline.co.uk/product/Fuel_Tank_Sende...
http://www.cbsonline.co.uk/product/Fuel_Tank_Sende...
Sure, stainless will look great and last for ever, but will the car. Will you own it for ever? In 20 years time will you be kicking yourself for fitting a mild steel one?
If you can find someone to do this job reliably, for a decent price, he might get a few more orders.
Thanks Joe, I am sure a steel tank would see me out....in 20 years I doubt if it would be me worrying about it (I'd be 85 by then!) so I will leave that worry to my son. I am sure I can get one made but I am not sure I can get it done right unless I take mine out (and I am then stuck) or borrow one. The filler would be the most difficult bit to get right. If I cannot borrow one it will have to be a winter job.
Putting the sender at the top would be an option but there is clear space at the existing side to get it a great deal higher which would get rid of that rapid change, and considerable fluctuations, in reading when the sender 'over-centres' when I am a little over half full.
I am certain the new tank will need baffles but, unless I was circuit racing, I cannot see the point of a swirl pot/crap collector can you? I have circuit raced a Ginetta and that didnt have one....we just didnt run it too low on fuel on the track.
Putting the sender at the top would be an option but there is clear space at the existing side to get it a great deal higher which would get rid of that rapid change, and considerable fluctuations, in reading when the sender 'over-centres' when I am a little over half full.
I am certain the new tank will need baffles but, unless I was circuit racing, I cannot see the point of a swirl pot/crap collector can you? I have circuit raced a Ginetta and that didnt have one....we just didnt run it too low on fuel on the track.
If required, tank baffles can be fitted similar to this
http://www.demon-tweeks.co.uk/motorsport/fuel-tank...
A cheaper option would be to weld a simple baffle plate around the outlet. Although fuel surge would only really be a problem with very hard cornering and low fuel.
As for the “crap catcher”, By welding a threaded boss onto the tank eg
http://www.demon-tweeks.co.uk/motorsport/fuel-tank...
you could then fit something similar to this
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/TRACTOR-FORD-2000-3000-4...
If you wanted to be really clever you could have pre-fabricated brackets welded to the side of the tank to hold the fuel pump and fuel filter with a weather proof protective cover to protect them.
http://www.demon-tweeks.co.uk/motorsport/fuel-tank...
A cheaper option would be to weld a simple baffle plate around the outlet. Although fuel surge would only really be a problem with very hard cornering and low fuel.
As for the “crap catcher”, By welding a threaded boss onto the tank eg
http://www.demon-tweeks.co.uk/motorsport/fuel-tank...
you could then fit something similar to this
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/TRACTOR-FORD-2000-3000-4...
If you wanted to be really clever you could have pre-fabricated brackets welded to the side of the tank to hold the fuel pump and fuel filter with a weather proof protective cover to protect them.
Thanks Tim and Peter, that is very interesting.
A plan comes together! If I keep it going to the winter I could get it steam cleaned properly inside and out, check it over with a borrowed garage endoscope and, if all is well, solder in a new outlet and solder up the old one! The whole swirl pot assembly appears to be soldered in anyway so it could potentially be removed and a blank plate soldered in. Then treat the inside as Tim did, and repaint the outside in something durable. Massively cheaper and all my own work
A plan comes together! If I keep it going to the winter I could get it steam cleaned properly inside and out, check it over with a borrowed garage endoscope and, if all is well, solder in a new outlet and solder up the old one! The whole swirl pot assembly appears to be soldered in anyway so it could potentially be removed and a blank plate soldered in. Then treat the inside as Tim did, and repaint the outside in something durable. Massively cheaper and all my own work 
greymrj said:
Hmmmm, thats interesting. Mine certainly has solder all round, just checked. I wonder if someone has had it out, and if so what for, or has it been an attempt to stop a leak? I also wonder if early cars, like mine, might perhaps have been made differently?
Or perhaps not. It beggars belief that TVR would solder a fuel tank with 12 gallons of fuel in it from new. Some amusing comments on this thread about the "swirl pot/ crap collector". Any of you guys ever bothered to remove the cam fitting and look inside. Dont be embarrassed to say no, nor did any of the dealers when they serviced them.Well, there is soldering and soldering.... If it's silver solder or braze, that would be just as good as welding in this case. If it's plumbers soft solder, then perhaps a little dubious unless there is a substantial area of overlap for it to hold.
Most of the rust will surely be at the bottom of the tank. If you slice the bottom off, you can get to it and clean it up, then maybe just weld in a new bottom. I have worked on tanks in the past. It is not as fraught with explosive danger as some make out. Drain it and leave it in a warm, well ventilated area for a couple of days. It will still stink of petrol, but that's just deposits on the tank walls. You can blow some compressed air through it for good measure before cutting/welding. Just be absolutely sure there is no liquid petrol remaining. My V8S tank had such a repair done for the previous owner by "Techniques" TVR in Hertfordshire. They did a decent job. www.techniquestvr.co.uk
Most of the rust will surely be at the bottom of the tank. If you slice the bottom off, you can get to it and clean it up, then maybe just weld in a new bottom. I have worked on tanks in the past. It is not as fraught with explosive danger as some make out. Drain it and leave it in a warm, well ventilated area for a couple of days. It will still stink of petrol, but that's just deposits on the tank walls. You can blow some compressed air through it for good measure before cutting/welding. Just be absolutely sure there is no liquid petrol remaining. My V8S tank had such a repair done for the previous owner by "Techniques" TVR in Hertfordshire. They did a decent job. www.techniquestvr.co.uk
I'm another one that did the POR15 treatment about 2 1/2 years back I think it was.
I've hardly used the S in the last year. 2 weeks before Chatsworth I decided it was about time to get it started as it would need an MOT a couple of days before Chatsworth. Had to jump start it and was going to just take it for a short run as there wasn't much fuel in it. I got about a mile from home when it started to misfire and then spluttered and came to a halt. Sent my brother to get 5ltrs of fuel to be safe. Got it going again but was still spluttering and misfiring. Managed to get it home and went through all the electrics and made no difference.
In the end decided to take the bottom ring from the fuel tank to check the little nylon filter and pulled this out instead
That is a good percentage of the por15 from the swirl pot bit. The nylon filter was clean. Could feel the remainder of the por15 in the swirl pot so pulled it of.
The fuel that I drained out (about 7ltrs) had quite a bit of rust particles in it.
Car ran fine after it was reassembled and passed its MOT. Didn't get to Chatsworth in the end due to other events. Came to use the car last weekend for the first time since the MOT and it's spluttering and misfiring again
I did use a borescope to have a look inside the tank to see what the inside of the tank looked like. From the bits I could see, the thickness of the por15 seemed to range from thin to pools of it. But due to the stiffness of the borescope lead and the baffles in the tank I could only see a small area.
Edited to add
This is the nylon filter from inside my tank when I removed it originally to do the por15 treatment.
I've hardly used the S in the last year. 2 weeks before Chatsworth I decided it was about time to get it started as it would need an MOT a couple of days before Chatsworth. Had to jump start it and was going to just take it for a short run as there wasn't much fuel in it. I got about a mile from home when it started to misfire and then spluttered and came to a halt. Sent my brother to get 5ltrs of fuel to be safe. Got it going again but was still spluttering and misfiring. Managed to get it home and went through all the electrics and made no difference.
In the end decided to take the bottom ring from the fuel tank to check the little nylon filter and pulled this out instead
That is a good percentage of the por15 from the swirl pot bit. The nylon filter was clean. Could feel the remainder of the por15 in the swirl pot so pulled it of.
The fuel that I drained out (about 7ltrs) had quite a bit of rust particles in it.
Car ran fine after it was reassembled and passed its MOT. Didn't get to Chatsworth in the end due to other events. Came to use the car last weekend for the first time since the MOT and it's spluttering and misfiring again
I did use a borescope to have a look inside the tank to see what the inside of the tank looked like. From the bits I could see, the thickness of the por15 seemed to range from thin to pools of it. But due to the stiffness of the borescope lead and the baffles in the tank I could only see a small area.
Edited to add
This is the nylon filter from inside my tank when I removed it originally to do the por15 treatment.
Edited by Russ35 on Wednesday 6th June 21:15
Hi Steve, TVR could certainly have soldered the tank, as they did on my old Grantura. Using the correct TYPE of solder and the appropriate area of solder contact a tank can be of entirely soldered construction.....I can show you some much older classic cars with big tanks made this way. It is however a slow and skillful job and wouldn't be used for mass produced tanks. However it could certainly be used to nsert a fitting or modify an existing tank. I had a post vintage car which had a tank outlet problem on a big steel tank, that was modified using soldering...by an expert. We are not talking about common electrical solder here, it is a very different alloy needing quite different tools and skills.
Incidentally, when you refer to the 'cam fitting' what exactly are you referring to? Bit puzzled by that. I certainly took the gauge fitting out and used it to insert a small endoscope, but it really wasn't the right type for the job and I couldn't see much.
Russ, you refer to 'removal of the bottom ring', that interests me. Did you have to unsolder it to get at the filter or was yours held in in some other way. Perhaps mine has been modified?
Incidentally, when you refer to the 'cam fitting' what exactly are you referring to? Bit puzzled by that. I certainly took the gauge fitting out and used it to insert a small endoscope, but it really wasn't the right type for the job and I couldn't see much.
Russ, you refer to 'removal of the bottom ring', that interests me. Did you have to unsolder it to get at the filter or was yours held in in some other way. Perhaps mine has been modified?
greymrj said:
Russ, you refer to 'removal of the bottom ring', that interests me. Did you have to unsolder it to get at the filter or was yours held in in some other way. Perhaps mine has been modified?
Bottom of the swirl pot on the bottom of the tank there should be one of these : Sealing Ring that holds a blanking disk in place, removing the ring gives you access into the little swirl pot and the filter that should fit over the fuel pickup pipe.Hmmmm, not like that on mine! I note that yours is a much later car, I wonder if the tank construction does differ slightly and whether TVR might have introduced the removable section in order to get at, and clean, that filter and swirl pot. Or indeed whether it was leaking on mine and someone soldered the plate in. Looks like tank out this winter and thorough investigation. I certainly have a few extra bits of information to follow up.
Thanks Russ, good photo and very interesting. I haven't 'scaled' it off yet but it looks as if your swirl pot is deeper than mine and I certainly haven't got the removable section that you have. A quick look at my tank (the car is outide and it is p...... down!) makes me wonder if it did have a removable section at one time but it was either damaged or leaked, and a plate has been soldered over. I am going to have to scrape off the stone chip etc, clean it up and have a look. I now know what I might be looking for, thanks. (Nice when one of those pics we take comes in handy to help someone else
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