Slide scanner problem?

[ehasler]

I've currently got a Canon FS4000 slide scanner, which I've never been 100% happy with.

There is nothing wrong with it as such, however the resultant scans from slides are never as sharp as I would like - even if the original slide is pin-sharp. I may just be expecting too much though...

Additionally, I've recently noticed (after scanning a bunch of slides in this weekend) that the colours on scans are sometimes out, although this is not consistent.

For example, I have two slides of aircraft (a WWII bomber and a Spitfire), which have very similar colour schemes. They are a similar size and position in the frame, and the sky is a very similar shade of blue in both slides.

I scanned both slides in the same go, but one came out exactly as the original slide, and the other came out very washed out (sky was light grey instead of blue, and the green and brown was very faded).

Another slide of a sunset came out with much less red in it than the original slide.

In both cases, no amount of messing around with Photoshop (although I'm no expert, so it may well be possible to sort it here, although I'd still prefer to get decent original scans to start with) seemed to do the job, and what was even more strange is that two similar slides with almost exactly the same colours had vastly different results.

Does anyone have any ideas what could be the problem?

Alternatively, does anyone have any thoughts on the new Nikon film scanners that have just come out?

[DustyC]

Perhaps its a sign of the lamp on its way out.
Slight flicker resulting in loss of luminence perhaps.
Less luminence could lead to duller colours. Red should be the first colour to go in low light conditions I believe. (At least it is when you go diving anyway).

[.Mark]

Interesting. I currently have a slide scanner on loan ( Cheers Luca) and I can't get good scans either.
They mostly come out grainy even if scanning them at a resolution of 2048xwhatever it is. I have to massively up the dpi of the scan before I get reasonable results but get a file size of extreme proportions and my machine refuses to work after.

I was wondering if it was something to do with the negative itself?

Hijack over.

[ehasler]

Possibly, although that wouldn't explain how two very similar slides scanned 1 minute apart come out vastly different.

[te51cle]

I've got an FS4000 too and my conclusion after over 2 years of use is, that it isn't very good. I get similar results to you with my slides and have found results from negatives to be better. I think the FS4000 is noisy and this is where half the problem comes from. Blue skies never look convincing. I've always been able to correct/enhance in Photoshop though.

I don't think the focussing is the best either but the manual focus method doesn't even look to be worth trying. Use of the Unsharp Mask in Filters has always brought up the image to the standard I like though. I usually use the three sliders in the ranges
amount: 100-140
radius: 1.8-3.6
threshold: 6-8

I've seen sharper results from the old Minolta 2700 dpi machines though which makes me think that the Dimage Scan Elite 5400 would be a beast worth looking at. However I've just seen a new Epson flatbed scanner that would make sense for me as I'm now interested in medium format.

[simpo two]

ehasler said:

Possibly, although that wouldn't explain how two very similar slides scanned 1 minute apart come out vastly different.

Have you tried scanning them again? Do you get the same result?

[ehasler]

simpo two said:

ehasler said: Possibly, although that wouldn't explain how two very similar slides scanned 1 minute apart come out vastly different. Have you tried scanning them again? Do you get the same result?

Yep - I tried a couple of times, in a different position on the slide holder as well, but they come out the same each time.

It's consistently inconsistent!

[ehasler]

te51cle said:

Use of the Unsharp Mask in Filters has always brought up the image to the standard I like though. I usually use the three sliders in the ranges amount: 100-140 radius: 1.8-3.6 threshold: 6-8 I've seen sharper results from the old Minolta 2700 dpi machines though which makes me think that the Dimage Scan Elite 5400 would be a beast worth looking at. However I've just seen a new Epson flatbed scanner that would make sense for me as I'm now interested in medium format.

It's interesting that you've got similar results with your FS4000. Like yourself, I've got decent enough results once I tweak the image in Photoshop, but feel that it could be even better if the scan was sharper.

I've been looking at the specs of the new Nikon 4000dpi scanners, and the Minolta, and they are looking quite tempting to be honest.

[simpo two]

ehasler said:

Yep - I tried a couple of times, in a different position on the slide holder as well, but they come out the same each time. It's consistently inconsistent!

OK, project the bastards onto a screen and rephotograph

[Bacardi]

Have you tried VueScan?

It is well respected third party software that allows such tricks as single-pass multiscanning (depending on scanner) to improve noise reduction and improve quality. Haven't used it for a year or so but the colours were more accurate than Minolta or Silverfast software.

Not the easiest of interfaces and if you try multiscanning be prepared for some loooooooooooong scan times but, if quality is your goal, well worth a look. You can download a demo and read more here:

www.hamrick.com/index.html

Cheap as chips as well.

[ehasler]

Bacardi said:

Have you tried VueScan?

Yep - this is what I use, and I've even tried multi pass scanning (you're right - it does take bloody ages!)

I think what I need to do is scan the problem slides using a different scanner and see how they come out on there...

[Bacardi]

ehasler said:

Bacardi said: Have you tried VueScan? Yep - this is what I use

Oh. Well you are using good software so maybe it is time to look at another scanner. I haven't any recommendations I'm afraid, I'm a little rusty with scanning technology these days. I have an old Minolta Scan Speed which is OK but is only 2800 dpi and doesn't have any of the fancy fluff removal technologies you can get with the newer scanners.

I have been thinking of buying a new scanner to scan some of my old stuff and it's amazing how the technology has moved on. The Minolta is SCSI so I have to boot back into OS 9 (mac) to get it to work. My other scanner is an old Umax powerlook 2000 which cost £3k some years back for 1200 dpi but the tranny hood has died. I need a scanner for some large format trannys so a dedicated film scanner is not really on. I only want to scan some stuff for the record so I can't warrant £5k for an Imacon or fork out for top notch drum scans.

I was thing about having ago with an Epson Perfection 4870 Photo and then running the scans under Binuscans PhotoRetouch (www.binuscan.com/us/prp) software which can perform magic on raw scans although it's pricey and, I think, only runs on mac. But the Epson at £324 for 4800 dpi is dirt cheap and will most probably do for my needs.

[ehasler]

I've been speaking to someone at Park Cameras, who was very helpful and gave me a few ideas.

1) Sharpness

I think I'm just being a bit unreasonable with my expectations, and to be honest, once I apply a bit of Unsharp Mask in Photoshop, my prints actually look pretty good. A more expensive scanner would probably give sharper scans, but I'm not convinced that I'd see much improvement unless you start looking at £4k+ Imacon jobbies.

2) Exposure

According to the guy at Park Cameras, the FS4000 apparently calculates the exposure for the batch of 4 slides rather than each one, and can get confused if there is a blank space, or if there is a particularly dark or light slide in the group.

I'm going to retry with just one slide in the holder, and see how I get on.

I've also found some hints on the Vuescan website, so will try these as well.

3) Calibration

I'm starting to gain a bit more understanding of how everything gets calibrated, so have now ordered a set of IT8 slide targets from Wolf Faust , and will calibrate my scanner.

[te51cle]

I think I'm going to go for the Epson 4870 in the near future. It includes SilverFast SE 6 scanning software which looks pretty good. I suspect that the manufacturers are going to give up on writing software themselves and just use 3rd party stuff. The Nikon scanning software I've seen looks pretty good but Minolta and especially Canon software is awful to use.

I'm particularly annoyed about Canon as I've been loyal to their products for 25 years !

Here's the link to SilverFast www.silverfast.com/show/silverfast-se/en.html

>> Edited by te51cle on Tuesday 10th February 21:28