Discussion
I was invited to a cousin's daughter's engagement party this weekend and they wanted me to 'take the photos'. No problem there, as it seemed little more than some casual groups, and besides, I'm working in Norwich that day so can't do it anyway.
However, they've now come back and said 'Never mind another time hopefully, her wedding is 4th sept 2010, so hopefully we can book u for that date'. But I have no idea if they're expecting a freebie (bearing in mind a full wedding is worth about £1,200 and I might lose another booking). Or are they expecting a 'mates rates' job? Weddings are jolly hard work and I'm not really happy about chopping the price too much if I'm going to be the 'professional' as opposed to the 'Uncle Phil'.
I'm rather stumped as to how to find out what they expect, without seeming too mercenary. Any ideas please?
However, they've now come back and said 'Never mind another time hopefully, her wedding is 4th sept 2010, so hopefully we can book u for that date'. But I have no idea if they're expecting a freebie (bearing in mind a full wedding is worth about £1,200 and I might lose another booking). Or are they expecting a 'mates rates' job? Weddings are jolly hard work and I'm not really happy about chopping the price too much if I'm going to be the 'professional' as opposed to the 'Uncle Phil'.
I'm rather stumped as to how to find out what they expect, without seeming too mercenary. Any ideas please?
Would you be invited to the wedding anyway ? If I was being invited and wanted to go I would use that as being im close enough to want to do it for free ( excluding any absolute direct costs ) You mention you may lose another booking which sounds like you may not be going anyway so probably not that fussed about the wedding ( excuse me if im wrong )
I think if it was a bit of a long lost cousin and I felt I was being used I would just duck out at this stage.
I think if it was a bit of a long lost cousin and I felt I was being used I would just duck out at this stage.
Exigeowner said:
Would you be invited to the wedding anyway ? If I was being invited and wanted to go I would use that as being im close enough to want to do it for free ( excluding any absolute direct costs )
It's fairly close family and only 20 miles away so I'd be invited anyway as a guest. However, I can either be a guest and enjoy the day, or be a photographer and work. Currently I have no booking for the same day, but as it's a year away there's a distinct chance somebody else will want me, so if I commit to the family wedding for £0 then I've thrown away £1,200.So if they want me to commit to that date now, I think some kind of payment is essential; however if they want me to do an Uncle Phil freebie, I'm happy to that as long as they don't expect the world and can keep it open until next summer (by which time I can be reasonably confident nobody else will want me that day).
Of course they be expecting to pay me the going rate, I don't know!
It's the going rate brainhurts.
I did one for a mate for free, but he gets me loads of work so I couldn't really charge (plus I'm no wedding photographer). If I were you I'd simply ask on what basis you are coming (to avoid any confusion). Explain that you may have to turn down a job.
Better front it out now than cause problems later.
IMHO
I did one for a mate for free, but he gets me loads of work so I couldn't really charge (plus I'm no wedding photographer). If I were you I'd simply ask on what basis you are coming (to avoid any confusion). Explain that you may have to turn down a job.
Better front it out now than cause problems later.
IMHO
Edited by GetCarter on Monday 19th October 13:59
I know, it's staggering. 8-10 hours almost solid work on the day in awkward lighting conditions, juggling the camera and flash settings instinctively whilst being gracious and polite to 100 guests at once, then a few days of the following week processing the RAW files and making everything as perfect as possible, usually 20% double-processed and composited to handle high contrast scenes, then sending them all (c.500) off on disk so the clients can make their own prints, copies and uploads for no extra.
By contrast, the monkey who fits wheelnuts at your local car dealer is charged out at £99ph + VAT
But we're getting off the point here - somehow I need to find out their expectations without being blatant.
By contrast, the monkey who fits wheelnuts at your local car dealer is charged out at £99ph + VAT
But we're getting off the point here - somehow I need to find out their expectations without being blatant.
Edited by Simpo Two on Monday 19th October 14:17
I think if I was in the situation I would just politely ask if you are to be a guest and they want a copy of your "snaps" from the day, or if you are to be there as the main tog.
If you'll be there in a working then it's only fair that you are paid. Even if at a reduced rate. As you say a full priced wedding shoot is a lot to loose.
I have the same sort of thing with detailing cars. My sister expects me to detail her car. I don't mind doing it but she knows paying customers come first.
If you'll be there in a working then it's only fair that you are paid. Even if at a reduced rate. As you say a full priced wedding shoot is a lot to loose.
I have the same sort of thing with detailing cars. My sister expects me to detail her car. I don't mind doing it but she knows paying customers come first.
I'm going with the consensus that seems to be forming and say however difficult do ask now the basis of the invite.
It's the way you earn your living so not entirely fair of them to expect a free wedding shoot but families are strange things. Best to discuss right now and then everyone knows where they stand and you know what is being expected of you.
If they are close I'd go and see them over a cup of tea rather than do through email / over the phone.
Chris
It's the way you earn your living so not entirely fair of them to expect a free wedding shoot but families are strange things. Best to discuss right now and then everyone knows where they stand and you know what is being expected of you.
If they are close I'd go and see them over a cup of tea rather than do through email / over the phone.
Chris
mneame said:
I think if I was in the situation I would just politely ask if you are to be a guest and they if want a copy of your "snaps" from the day.
This is what I ended up doing for my cousins wedding. She was happy and I got to enjoy the wedding. I wanted to come as a guest and have fun. It helped that I took one SLR, a 50mm lens and no flash. Gave out about 20 photos in the end. Not the 'perfect' wedding pics but a good reminder of the day. The bottom folder on this site - christieimages.com
Your other option is to shoot the wedding as a Pro, as you normally would. If you do this then you will not really get to enjoy most of the wedding as you will be working. Charge your normal rate but do a very good job. If you want to give a discount then make it a free album. Reducing your rates just makes what you do cheap, not a (very) nice offer. Very good work will be remembered though.
I'm no photographer (as you know) but I volunteered to take photos at my girlfriends Dad's surprise 60th party - If I hadn't then there wouldn't have been such good coverage of the evening from setting up, people arriving, his arrival through to the end of the night.
As much as I enjoyed doing it, I didn't fully enjoy the night as a guest as I wasn't a proper guest as I had to take the photos.
I guess the solution to the moral dilemma comes down to whether you want to be able to enjoy the day or not - I'd be inclined to say (in a polite way) that either you're a guest at the wedding or you're not, or try to come up with an agreed compromise where you do some photos (for a lesser fee) but not a full set.
ETA:
As much as I enjoyed doing it, I didn't fully enjoy the night as a guest as I wasn't a proper guest as I had to take the photos.
I guess the solution to the moral dilemma comes down to whether you want to be able to enjoy the day or not - I'd be inclined to say (in a polite way) that either you're a guest at the wedding or you're not, or try to come up with an agreed compromise where you do some photos (for a lesser fee) but not a full set.
ETA:
Simpo Two said:
'Never mind another time hopefully, her wedding is 4th sept 2010, so hopefully we can book u for that date'
This suggests that they would be willing to pay properly - surely they can't expect to get a photographer for free - do you know them well enough to be able to understand what they may expect?Edited by james_tigerwoods on Tuesday 20th October 08:52
It could be they want the best of both worlds - eg. they want you as a guest, but also knowing the fact that you'll take some decent photo's during the day as well.
This is pretty much what I did for my brother - I was going to the wedding anyway, but they asked if I could take some pics as well - I ended up giving them a dvd and album as their wedding present.
This is pretty much what I did for my brother - I was going to the wedding anyway, but they asked if I could take some pics as well - I ended up giving them a dvd and album as their wedding present.
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