Telescope?

[Comacchio]

Haven't posted in this section in a long while.. Life's gotten in the way!

3rd wedding anniversary coming up - modern gift is glass/crystal. Got me thinking - my favourite kind of photography is astro/nightscapes. Looking for recommendations for a scope that I could couple my Canon 550d to, price bracket around £200 - even if the recommendation is don't bother in this price range. Initially a basic manual setup would be fine, nice to have would be a motor to allow tracking for longer exposures.

Cheers.

[lancslad58]

You’ll not get very far on your budget I’m afraid to say. A decent starter reflector will cost that, a motorized mount will be about the same and then there’s the camera mount. Plus, don’t forget all those photos you see with spectacular colors are taken with specialist cameras. I’ve seen the Orion nebula through a telescope and it’s just grey.

However, you as already have the camera you could get away with a standard camera tripod and have a go at “widefield” photography, no motorized mount required, you can keep the shutter open for a few seconds before you get star trails. You might need to take several images and then combine them using stacking software, there are plenty of free ones available.

Its very addictive but rewarding, I’d recommend popping over to Stargazers Lounge for a good look around.

https://stargazerslounge.com/

https://stargazerslounge.com/forum/38-imaging-wide...



Finally, a nice warm coat, wooly hat and gloves for those Winter nights

[Comacchio]

lancslad58 said:

You’ll not get very far on your budget I’m afraid to say. A decent starter reflector will cost that, a motorized mount will be about the same and then there’s the camera mount. Plus, don’t forget all those photos you see with spectacular colors are taken with specialist cameras. I’ve seen the Orion nebula through a telescope and it’s just grey.

However, you as already have the camera you could get away with a standard camera tripod and have a go at “widefield” photography, no motorized mount required, you can keep the shutter open for a few seconds before you get star trails. You might need to take several images and then combine them using stacking software, there are plenty of free ones available.

Its very addictive but rewarding, I’d recommend popping over to Stargazers Lounge for a good look around.

https://stargazerslounge.com/

https://stargazerslounge.com/forum/38-imaging-wide...



Finally, a nice warm coat, wooly hat and gloves for those Winter nights

Thanks - will check those sites out. Still have my heart set on a scope of some kind though. I've had a few brief forays into star trails:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/allanjones/630391156...


https://www.flickr.com/photos/allanjones/636023730...

https://www.flickr.com/photos/allanjones/588256183...

[nordboy]

I've never really got into the astronomy photography thing. My wife bought me a Celestron Nexstar SLT telescope a couple of years ago, I used it a handful of times and it now stands in the office. The whole computer/ tracking thing is very clever indeed, once it's set up.

I should really get around to selling it.

As has been mentioned, to get a real decent scope, you're going to have to up your budget quite a bit imo, camera mounts etc can add quite a few ££. It's probably one of those things that before you know it, you wish you'd spent more as you outgrow it quickly.

[Comacchio]

nordboy said:

I've never really got into the astronomy photography thing. My wife bought me a Celestron Nexstar SLT telescope a couple of years ago, I used it a handful of times and it now stands in the office. The whole computer/ tracking thing is very clever indeed, once it's set up.

I should really get around to selling it.

As has been mentioned, to get a real decent scope, you're going to have to up your budget quite a bit imo, camera mounts etc can add quite a few ££. It's probably one of those things that before you know it, you wish you'd spent more as you outgrow it quickly.

I'll take it off your hands... couple of years depreciation... call it say, £200?

I appreciate for good quality I'm looking at many magnitudes of £200, but if I could get something to get me going, see if I enjoy it I don't mind investing further down the line. I'll have an ask on Stargazer and see what's recommended. Thanks.

[ALPandy90]

What have you got by way of lenses for the 550D?

£200 would probably get you a Rokinon/Samyang 85mm f1.4, which gets decent results on a lot of night sky targets: https://astrogeartoday.com/good-performance-good-p...

Or if you already have a decent lens, consider one of the cheaper star-trackers. If you shop around, I'm sure you could find a Star Adventurer Mini about £200-250

[geeks]

ALPandy90 said:

What have you got by way of lenses for the 550D?

£200 would probably get you a Rokinon/Samyang 85mm f1.4, which gets decent results on a lot of night sky targets: https://astrogeartoday.com/good-performance-good-p...

Or if you already have a decent lens, consider one of the cheaper star-trackers. If you shop around, I'm sure you could find a Star Adventurer Mini about £200-250

This would be my advice, get a star tracker first then look at the glass. Even cheap simple glass with a star tracker will provide some excellent results. You should be able to pick up a star adventurer (go for the wifi enabled one) for your budget or an AZ GTi that (if you are computer savy) you can flush the firmware on and then run as an EQ mount (it is a very well trodden path so even if you aren't very computer savy there are plenty of youtube guides to get you there) I am selling my iExos EQ mount soon which would be a great little starter mount for this however you are a little far away to make it worth your while sadly. Happy to answer any questions you might have though have been at this a while an example of a widefield on some cheap glass on a cheap tracker. Also have a peek in the Astrophotography thread here, it's been a bit quiet of late but is full of lots of advice.

https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...


The Sadr Region - Canon 6D - 50m lens @F4 - 110 x 120s exposures.

[Comacchio]

ALPandy90 said:

What have you got by way of lenses for the 550D?

£200 would probably get you a Rokinon/Samyang 85mm f1.4, which gets decent results on a lot of night sky targets: https://astrogeartoday.com/good-performance-good-p...

Or if you already have a decent lens, consider one of the cheaper star-trackers. If you shop around, I'm sure you could find a Star Adventurer Mini about £200-250

Thanks - yes the more research I do the more I realise I'm actually just looking for a star tracking mount at the moment. Lenses I currently have:

Canon EF-S 10-22mm f3.5-4.5 USM
Canon EF-S 15-88mm f3.5-5.6 IS
Canon EF 28-80mm f3.5-5.6
Canon EF 50mm f1.8 II
Canon EF-S 60mm f2.8 USM (Macro)
Canon EF 100mm f2.8L IS USM (Macro)
Canon EF-S 55-250mm f4-5.6
Canon EF 75-300mm f4-5.6 III

(Gifted) 'Jintu' 420-800mm 'Super Telephoto' with 2x Teleconverter - Seems to be f8.3-16
Raynox DCR250 Super macro conversion lens
Kenko extension tubes

[Comacchio]

geeks said:

This would be my advice, get a star tracker first then look at the glass. Even cheap simple glass with a star tracker will provide some excellent results. You should be able to pick up a star adventurer (go for the wifi enabled one) for your budget or an AZ GTi that (if you are computer savy) you can flush the firmware on and then run as an EQ mount (it is a very well trodden path so even if you aren't very computer savy there are plenty of youtube guides to get you there) I am selling my iExos EQ mount soon which would be a great little starter mount for this however you are a little far away to make it worth your while sadly. Happy to answer any questions you might have though have been at this a while an example of a widefield on some cheap glass on a cheap tracker. Also have a peek in the Astrophotography thread here, it's been a bit quiet of late but is full of lots of advice.

https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...


The Sadr Region - Canon 6D - 50m lens @F4 - 110 x 120s exposures.

I work in IT so will look into both the options you've recommended thank you. That's an incredible image - well done - would love to capture something half as good as that! I live in a class 7 zone, but a 45 min drive gets me to class 3.

Will check that thread out also cheers.

[S13_Alan]

It makes things a bit more annoying but it's perfectly possible to get really good results even with that level of light pollution. I'm about the same and also everything I've posted on that other thread was taken using the AZ-GTi mount that geeks mentioned.

If you're wanting more scope for stuff you can do in future and are happy with messing around with computers then one of those (if you can get one cheap) over a star tracker isn't a bad bet imo. It is a proper goto mount but it needs a computer to do polar alignment properly and the Gti was never intended for photography. They did bring out a newer one which is called the Star Adventurer GTi but it's also a lot more expensive.

You need a couple of things to make it work for photos (counterweight, a threaded bar, and a adjustable wedge to do the elevation adjustment) and then you can re-flash it as geeks said to run in alt-az mode.

It's a lot to take in and learn, but basically you'd connect the camera and mount to PC via USB, then running software you can do what's called plate solving, which is automatic location detection via analysis of the stars in an image. This can help you with polar alignment as it takes photos, works out where it's pointing in the sky and then tells you how far to tweak the mount to align it.

Takes practice but once that's done you just tell it what you want to point at and it can do the rest - this opens up lots of options for you. Want to take a 30 sec image of Andromeda... done.

Vs finding it manually and getting all lines up with a star tracker - I opted to skip that frustration.

[geeks]

Comacchio said:

ALPandy90 said:

What have you got by way of lenses for the 550D?

£200 would probably get you a Rokinon/Samyang 85mm f1.4, which gets decent results on a lot of night sky targets: https://astrogeartoday.com/good-performance-good-p...

Or if you already have a decent lens, consider one of the cheaper star-trackers. If you shop around, I'm sure you could find a Star Adventurer Mini about £200-250

Thanks - yes the more research I do the more I realise I'm actually just looking for a star tracking mount at the moment. Lenses I currently have:

Canon EF-S 10-22mm f3.5-4.5 USM
Canon EF-S 15-88mm f3.5-5.6 IS
Canon EF 28-80mm f3.5-5.6
Canon EF 50mm f1.8 II
Canon EF-S 60mm f2.8 USM (Macro)
Canon EF 100mm f2.8L IS USM (Macro)
Canon EF-S 55-250mm f4-5.6
Canon EF 75-300mm f4-5.6 III

(Gifted) 'Jintu' 420-800mm 'Super Telephoto' with 2x Teleconverter - Seems to be f8.3-16
Raynox DCR250 Super macro conversion lens
Kenko extension tubes

Stick with Prime or fixed focal length lenses if you can. Just keep in mind the longer the focal length the more accurate your tracking needs to be. You'll get a feel for fstop on each lens as you go, mainly you are trying to avoid odd shaped stars across the field of view.

Comacchio said:

geeks said:

This would be my advice, get a star tracker first then look at the glass. Even cheap simple glass with a star tracker will provide some excellent results. You should be able to pick up a star adventurer (go for the wifi enabled one) for your budget or an AZ GTi that (if you are computer savy) you can flush the firmware on and then run as an EQ mount (it is a very well trodden path so even if you aren't very computer savy there are plenty of youtube guides to get you there) I am selling my iExos EQ mount soon which would be a great little starter mount for this however you are a little far away to make it worth your while sadly. Happy to answer any questions you might have though have been at this a while an example of a widefield on some cheap glass on a cheap tracker. Also have a peek in the Astrophotography thread here, it's been a bit quiet of late but is full of lots of advice.

https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...


The Sadr Region - Canon 6D - 50m lens @F4 - 110 x 120s exposures.

I work in IT so will look into both the options you've recommended thank you. That's an incredible image - well done - would love to capture something half as good as that! I live in a class 7 zone, but a 45 min drive gets me to class 3.

Will check that thread out also cheers.

Ah ok in that case definitely have a look for an AZ GTi second hand (thought a new one will only set you back £250) as they have got alot cheaper and plentiful since the Star Adventurer GTI came along, get an eqmod cable and a wedge and you'll be set. The routine to get the EQ firmware on the GTi is a doddle, you can then start with just running it from the phone app in the field or when at home you can run it using all manner of Astro software and the cable. If you are into Pi stuff then I would recommend astroberry as a distro that just works out of the box, the ASI Air things are superb but pricey for what they are and the lack of third party camera support cam be a real PITA. Happy to help I have a GTi that I use for my field work and that widefield was taken using it as well. Main heavy rig for deep sky stuff is much less portable shall we say lol.

I will say don't be discouraged if your first 5 attempts aren't as good as you hoped its a tricky hobby sometimes and also I would say never compare your image to other peoples. Much of the difficulty with astro imaging is the processing and editing dont be tempted by the denoise slider too much. Watch everything by Nico Carver particularly his No Tracker No Problem series, will teach you so much from a beginner level (as well as show you what is possible without a tracker) at a sensible pace and he goes start to finish with everything that us super easy to follow and he even gives example data sets to work with as well. I live in a B4 which is where that image was taken from however I used to live in a B7/8 and was able to do plenty from there but you have to pick your targets and battles with light pollution, Orion is easy for example as it is nice and bright and big, same with Andromeda, go scooping bright easy to find and easy to process stuff first. Some poster earlier mentioned needing specialised cameras, simply not true for so so so many targets, yes there are targets that require specialist filters and thus specialist cameras but honestly there is so much to image without them that realistically you really dont need to worry about that just yet (and I say this as someone with 2 dedicated astro cameras lol)

[geeks]

S13_Alan said:

It makes things a bit more annoying but it's perfectly possible to get really good results even with that level of light pollution. I'm about the same and also everything I've posted on that other thread was taken using the AZ-GTi mount that geeks mentioned.

If you're wanting more scope for stuff you can do in future and are happy with messing around with computers then one of those (if you can get one cheap) over a star tracker isn't a bad bet imo. It is a proper goto mount but it needs a computer to do polar alignment properly and the Gti was never intended for photography. They did bring out a newer one which is called the Star Adventurer GTi but it's also a lot more expensive.

You need a couple of things to make it work for photos (counterweight, a threaded bar, and a adjustable wedge to do the elevation adjustment) and then you can re-flash it as geeks said to run in alt-az mode.

It's a lot to take in and learn, but basically you'd connect the camera and mount to PC via USB, then running software you can do what's called plate solving, which is automatic location detection via analysis of the stars in an image. This can help you with polar alignment as it takes photos, works out where it's pointing in the sky and then tells you how far to tweak the mount to align it.

Takes practice but once that's done you just tell it what you want to point at and it can do the rest - this opens up lots of options for you. Want to take a 30 sec image of Andromeda... done.

Vs finding it manually and getting all lines up with a star tracker - I opted to skip that frustration.

This man speaks sense as well. Hows it going Alan? Been a while!

[S13_Alan]

Do think for something who likes technology and photography, like I do, that astrophotography... and more the hands off automated do via your pc kind... is the pinnacle of what you can achieve. Once you've had a go at all the other photography disciplines it's just so much more satisfying, and now it's very much (least relatively) approachable. Slippery slope financially right enough if you get hooked.

geeks said:

This man speaks sense as well. Hows it going Alan? Been a while!

Cheers, not often that's said, hope you're doing alright.

Aside from the weather not having been very kind this year, I've been exhausted after catching Covid multiple times and really not had energy to be out late at night doing stuff since I took that last Andromeda photo.

Parents are looking for a present for my 40th this year though, so thinking saying at least contribute to an EQ6-R Pro and that will be something I can keep and use forever, as it is a lifelong hobby. Will appreciate that far more than a watch or something folk normally go for.

Then lets me get a bigger scope too... woohoo.

[Comacchio]

geeks said:

Ah ok in that case definitely have a look for an AZ GTi second hand (thought a new one will only set you back £250) as they have got alot cheaper and plentiful since the Star Adventurer GTI came along, get an eqmod cable and a wedge and you'll be set. The routine to get the EQ firmware on the GTi is a doddle, you can then start with just running it from the phone app in the field or when at home you can run it using all manner of Astro software and the cable. If you are into Pi stuff then I would recommend astroberry as a distro that just works out of the box, the ASI Air things are superb but pricey for what they are and the lack of third party camera support cam be a real PITA. Happy to help I have a GTi that I use for my field work and that widefield was taken using it as well. Main heavy rig for deep sky stuff is much less portable shall we say lol.

I will say don't be discouraged if your first 5 attempts aren't as good as you hoped its a tricky hobby sometimes and also I would say never compare your image to other peoples. Much of the difficulty with astro imaging is the processing and editing dont be tempted by the denoise slider too much. Watch everything by Nico Carver particularly his No Tracker No Problem series, will teach you so much from a beginner level (as well as show you what is possible without a tracker) at a sensible pace and he goes start to finish with everything that us super easy to follow and he even gives example data sets to work with as well. I live in a B4 which is where that image was taken from however I used to live in a B7/8 and was able to do plenty from there but you have to pick your targets and battles with light pollution, Orion is easy for example as it is nice and bright and big, same with Andromeda, go scooping bright easy to find and easy to process stuff first. Some poster earlier mentioned needing specialised cameras, simply not true for so so so many targets, yes there are targets that require specialist filters and thus specialist cameras but honestly there is so much to image without them that realistically you really dont need to worry about that just yet (and I say this as someone with 2 dedicated astro cameras lol)

Thanks for this! Could I be a bit cheeky and ask if you could drop me some links for a complete setup please? Don’t mind buying new. Mount, cable, wedge, dovetail etc please? I’ve already got a Redsnapper tripod that I imagine will do the job?

Have used Raspberry PIs in work for a few solutions but haven’t had much time to experiment at home, will probably get one at some point!

[geeks]

S13_Alan said:

Cheers, not often that's said, hope you're doing alright.

Aside from the weather not having been very kind this year, I've been exhausted after catching Covid multiple times and really not had energy to be out late at night doing stuff since I took that last Andromeda photo.

Parents are looking for a present for my 40th this year though, so thinking saying at least contribute to an EQ6-R Pro and that will be something I can keep and use forever, as it is a lifelong hobby. Will appreciate that far more than a watch or something folk normally go for.

Then lets me get a bigger scope too... woohoo.

Yes bud all well thanks, same here just not had a chance to get the kit out, shame as I was supposed to have put the observatory together but it just hasnt happened sadly.

EQ6R Pro is a lovely mount, have been looking at the CQ350 to replace my EQ6 but it will have to wait until the ob is up.

Comacchio said:

Thanks for this! Could I be a bit cheeky and ask if you could drop me some links for a complete setup please? Don’t mind buying new. Mount, cable, wedge, dovetail etc please? I’ve already got a Redsnapper tripod that I imagine will do the job?

Have used Raspberry PIs in work for a few solutions but haven’t had much time to experiment at home, will probably get one at some point!

Sure...

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/skywatcher-mounts...
https://www.firstlightoptics.com/sky-watcher-mount...
https://www.firstlightoptics.com/skywatcher-star-a...
https://www.firstlightoptics.com/skywatcher-star-a...
https://www.rothervalleyoptics.co.uk/skywatcher-1k... (select the one with the thread adapter)
https://www.firstlightoptics.com/dovetails-saddles...

That should be enough to get you started.

[Comacchio]

geeks said:

Sure...

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/skywatcher-mounts...
https://www.firstlightoptics.com/sky-watcher-mount...
https://www.firstlightoptics.com/skywatcher-star-a...
https://www.firstlightoptics.com/skywatcher-star-a...
https://www.rothervalleyoptics.co.uk/skywatcher-1k... (select the one with the thread adapter)
https://www.firstlightoptics.com/dovetails-saddles...

That should be enough to get you started.

Many thanks! Will have a look at this today.

[Comacchio]

geeks said:

Sure...

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/skywatcher-mounts...
https://www.firstlightoptics.com/sky-watcher-mount...
https://www.firstlightoptics.com/skywatcher-star-a...
https://www.firstlightoptics.com/skywatcher-star-a...
https://www.rothervalleyoptics.co.uk/skywatcher-1k... (select the one with the thread adapter)
https://www.firstlightoptics.com/dovetails-saddles...

That should be enough to get you started.

So eventually got round to looking at this. Now have all the equipment above and just need a RaspberryPI running Astroberry or something. Got to admit I feel totally in over my head, unsure how to even do a polar alignment at this point!

I’ve set the wedge to 55/56 degrees or so as I’m in the Glasgow area. Think I possibly need a bigger counterweight or a smaller camera mount as the ball head I’m using seems quite chunky and I can’t get it perfectly balanced.



Clear skies tonight so once the mrs is in bed I’ll venture out to the garden and see if I can get it pointing at Polaris.

[geeks]

Lose the ball head bud will make things easier. Polar alignment will require Astroberry or similar to get right. Getting Polaris dead centre of the shot at a short focal length should be ok for testing stuff out though. You’ll get there with it all with a little patience. Feel free to PM if you need some extra advice.

[geeks]

Forgot to pop this up. This is my one of those setup

[Comacchio]

geeks said:

Lose the ball head bud will make things easier. Polar alignment will require Astroberry or similar to get right. Getting Polaris dead centre of the shot at a short focal length should be ok for testing stuff out though. You’ll get there with it all with a little patience. Feel free to PM if you need some extra advice.

Thanks - the ball head is temporary as I don't have a short enough bolt for the camera to mount securely, need to find some washers.

I've acquired a RasPi 3B+ that I'll try to build over the weekend. Definitely need a batter pack or something I think - Camera died within 30 minutes last night due to the cold.