Nikon 300 /F4 AFS + 1.4TC vs Nikon 200-500 /F5.6

[eltawater]

I'm looking ahead towards my first trip to RIAT this year and reassessing my kit bag in readiness for some good old fast jet action.

I'm intending to bring my DX D7000 and my FX D610 body.
Lens wise I currently own a 70-300VR which I'm planning to use with the D7000 to give me a good trade off of reach vs image quality. The crop factor is useful but is pegged back a bit by the lower resolution sensor.

With my D610 I'd like to get some further reach to compliment the higher resolution sensor.
With airshows lately, I've found that the post-shoreham world means that planes are flying further and further from the crowdline which means I'm having to do a lot of cropping.

So it looks a spot of kit acquisition is in order I'm considering either a prime 300 /F4 AFS coupled with a 1.4TC or a 200-500 F5.6 . To my mind I'd be trading the quality of the prime against the flexibility of the zoom. Hopefully my D7000 + 70-300 will take care of my short range zoom requirements.

Both would be mounted on a monopod so hopefully weight shouldn't be too much of an issue.

Would be most appreciative of any advice from you all

Many thanks

[toohuge]

Interesting thread here for your interest too:

https://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/4142046


It's a funny question, I suppose you need to work out exactly what you are looking for in a telephoto. Is it versatility and low light shooting - then the 200-500 is a good option. Or is it out right AF speed and ruggedness? Personally - I am shooting a lot of sport at the moment and AF speed and wide aperture are my top priorities, VR is not necessary for what I do.

Are you planning on shooting at these focal lengths outside of airshows? Nature / sports / low light conditions?

[eltawater]

It'd be purely for airshows so I'd prioritise AF speed over light I think.

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eltawater said:

It'd be purely for airshows so I'd prioritise AF speed over light I think.

Ok... that'll come down to your experience... I have never shot an airshow - so can't comment! However, missed shots from slow AF is a real pain ime. My experience of pro Nikon AF-S lenses has always been very fast AF speed (something the Canon boys take for granted in their lenses ). I don't have any experience of the 80-400 AF-S - but I have heard that has fast AF speed coupled with an effective AF system, which might be a good middle ground for you?

[Nigel_O]

I use a 200-500 on a D810 for motorsports. Its a fairly weighty combination, but I mostly use it hand-held. To get any background blur, I have to keep the shutter speed fairly slow, which increases the chances of some shake in the image.

If you're into fast jets, shutter speed is less of a consideration, so you should be able to go a fair bit faster.

The problem I find with monopods at airshows is that by the time the plane is close enough to shoot, its higher in the sky and the monopod usually isn't tall enough, so I just end up hand-held anyway

the 200-500 isn't the last word in AF speed, but I find it OK if the panning technique is half-decent

FWIW, I find that a good shoulder strap is a great addition to weighty kit - it allows you to simply let go of the camera and give the arms a rest - I use a BlackRapid Sport - one of the most useful items in my kit bag

Edited by Nigel_O on Thursday 22 February 16:27

[toohuge]

Nigel_O said:

FWIW, I find that a good shoulder strap is a great addition to weight kit - it allows you to simply let go of the camera and give the arms a rest - I use a BlackRapid Sport - one of the most useful items in my kit bag

Me too - lifesaver.

[eltawater]

Thanks both.

I've learnt the hard way about the need for shoulder straps (70-200 2.8 sigma being lugged about at children's parties!) so already have both a dual strap and a neoprene single strap to take the weight off things. I'm going to be there two days so having the option of using the monopod is handy just to give everything a bit of a rest.

Many of the reviews for the 80-400 seem to be from owners whom have subsequently upgraded to a 200-500 so I figured I may as well skip that step and jump right in

I'm less interested in prop stuff at RIAT as I live near Old Warden so I can get my fix there anytime. Waddington was great for the fast stuff so I'm really looking forward to seeing them again at RIAT.

This was from Waddo 2013 so I'd like to get closer if possible.


DSC_4698 by eltawater, on Flickr

[Nigel_O]

Nice shot - however, its only at 155mm, so you weren't using all of the 300mm you had available to you at the time. Even on the crop-sensor body, your FF equivalent was about 225mm, so still within the reach of your current lens.

I get your point that the flight line has moved a long way from the crowd line since Shoreham, so the extra reach will probably be needed

If you're ever passing close to Stafford out of working hours, you're welcome to try my 200-500 on your body

[SCEtoAUX]

I have the 200-500mm AF-S and the ONLY negative is that the AF is a little slow. That's on a D700, which is a fairly old body I grant you.

It's heavy for sure, but it is tack sharp at all apertures and all focal lengths. The same can't be said about the Sigma and Tamron alternatives. (In fact, I tried the Sigma 150-600mm alongside the Nikon before parting with my money. Absolutely no comparison, and when it comes to resale, the Nikon would have cost less to own).

I think the only people who really worry about cropping are the people doing the cropping. Hell, you've got 6000 pixels to play with on a D610, even if you chuck away 3/4 of them you're still looking good for pretty decent sized prints.

[richelli]

Why not just rent your dream lens for the week then send it back and go on holiday with the rest of the money!

[Simpo Two]

How about the D7000 with the Nikon 200-500? Crop sensor + bonkers telephoto = max reach.

If you can't fit them in put the 70-300 on.

[eltawater]

Nigel_O said:

Nice shot - however, its only at 155mm, so you weren't using all of the 300mm you had available to you at the time. Even on the crop-sensor body, your FF equivalent was about 225mm, so still within the reach of your current lens.

I get your point that the flight line has moved a long way from the crowd line since Shoreham, so the extra reach will probably be needed

If you're ever passing close to Stafford out of working hours, you're welcome to try my 200-500 on your body

Thanks for the offer

This gives you an idea of what I was getting at Duxford last year almost at full reach for the 70-300 on the D7000, you can see the 1:1 crop if you click through to thumbsnap. I think that optically I was really pushing my luck with the poor light on the saturday afternoon and so I'd like to do better at RIAT if possible.

SCEtoAUX said:

I have the 200-500mm AF-S and the ONLY negative is that the AF is a little slow. That's on a D700, which is a fairly old body I grant you.

It's heavy for sure, but it is tack sharp at all apertures and all focal lengths. The same can't be said about the Sigma and Tamron alternatives. (In fact, I tried the Sigma 150-600mm alongside the Nikon before parting with my money. Absolutely no comparison, and when it comes to resale, the Nikon would have cost less to own).

Thanks that's good to know!

richelli said:

Why not just rent your dream lens for the week then send it back and go on holiday with the rest of the money!

I can't book it this far in advance from lensesforhire and once the return costs are factored in, it's costing me £100 for six days. May as well buy the lens and take it to a few more airshows

Simpo Two said:

How about the D7000 with the Nikon 200-500? Crop sensor + bonkers telephoto = max reach.

If you can't fit them in put the 70-300 on.

It's something I'm planning to do on the Friday display just so I can get an idea of what does and doesn't work ahead of Saturday.

[richelli]

It is always nicer to own one, was just an idea. I have a d500 with a sigma 150-600 c and a Nikon 200-500 f5.6 and the Nikon is a very good lens. Obviously on a d500 I'm getting good reach with a 1.4 crop factor. I do low level military aviation in the lake district and a good telephoto is definitely an advantage when you can't guarantee the distance from the aircraft.

[Nigel_O]

An example shot with the 200-500, with a 1.7x TC - the distance is about 900 to 1000m - almost no cropping and very little PP

Lake Vyrnwy straining tower from above the hotel by Nigel Ogram, on Flickr

OK, so the subject matter wasn't moving, which makes the AF performance irrelevant, but its still pretty sharp for nearly a kilometre away

[eltawater]

Nigel_O said:

An example shot with the 200-500, with a 1.7x TC - the distance is about 900 to 1000m - almost no cropping and very little PP

Sold! Thanks all for the input, time to wait for some funds to be released from SWMBO for a bit of kit acquisition

[eltawater]

Just to close this one off, I spent Friday and Saturday at RIAT mixing and matching the 200-500 + 1.4xTC and the 70-300 lenses on my D7000 and D610 bodies.

I'm really happy with how the 200-500 performed especially with the TC attached as I had for the immediate shot below. I'd learnt my lesson from my many trips to my neighbouring Falconry centre and Old Warden to keep it extended and focused at the long end rather than trying to constantly zoom in and out.


D61_6650 by eltawater, on Flickr

The extra length was really helpful for some of the fast jets as they disappeared into the heavens and for some of the runway crew shots, but haze started to become an issue at longer distances.


D61_6749 by eltawater, on Flickr


D61_6954 by eltawater, on Flickr


D61_8202 by eltawater, on Flickr


D61_9490 by eltawater, on Flickr


D61_9478 by eltawater, on Flickr


D61_8189 by eltawater, on Flickr


D61_7977 by eltawater, on Flickr


D61_6921 by eltawater, on Flickr


D61_8728 by eltawater, on Flickr


DSC_6691 by eltawater, on Flickr


D61_6241 by eltawater, on Flickr


D61_8509 by eltawater, on Flickr

[Nigel_O]

Very nice shots - did you go hand-held in the end?

[eltawater]

Yes, I was in the viewing village grandstand on the Friday and the garden on the Saturday so didn't need the monopod in the end.
Did need the rainproof cover from my lowepro bag and the lens hood to keep the big one dry on the Friday though!

[Simpo Two]

Some amazing photos there Eltawater, have TWO biscuits!

[Vintage Racer]

[quote=eltawater]Just to close this one off, I spent Friday and Saturday at RIAT mixing and matching the 200-500 + 1.4xTC and the 70-300 lenses on my D7000 and D610 bodies.

I'm really happy with how the 200-500 performed especially with the TC attached as I had for the immediate shot below. I'd learnt my lesson from my many trips to my neighbouring Falconry centre and Old Warden to keep it extended and focused at the long end rather than trying to constantly zoom in and out.

Out of interest, which 1.4tc were you using?...........Not sure that I can afford the tc-14eiii, but the earlier series 1 seems about my budget and appear to be the same as the version ii anyway.