Pro moving picture thread...

[Bacardi]

For want of a better title…

It seems there are a few professionals, broadcast, corporate, who post here so thought it might be an idea to have a thread and chit chat about random things above the prosumer chat. Cameras, Optics, Lights, Audio, Grip, Software, PP etc…

So following on from Yorkchimp’s post on Tuna’s 4k editing thread which went a bit off topic...

Yorkchimp said:

For 2 of the projects we shot in 8k and 6K with epic-w and epic dragon and delivered at a resolution between 6 and 8k with blended projection and a watchout server, your resolution is split across multiple projections which makes it possible to get ultra high resolution.

So similar idea to Imax, but (relatively) cheaper using Laser?

Yorkchimp said:

Yes you’re right - the only 8k monitor is one made by dell but I would say watch this space for what is coming with other manufacturers, particularly with the next olympics being shot and transmitted in 8k.

I’m sure you are right, but still seems a bit overkill if you can only watch it on a 32” monitor… unless of course you have multiple projectors but I suspect there’s some hefty compression going on to get 8k through the pipes.

Yorkchimp said:

We’ve got an arri classic - it is beautiful, but horses for courses dependent on your end delivery and it upscales for 4K which isn’t always what you want.

The classic is only 2k? Even if it does look good upscaled isn’t going to be able to compete with native 8k on pure detail, if that’s what you ultimately need. Had a news feed in my inbox last week with a breakdown on cameras used for films submitted to the Sundance festival. As you’d expect quite a few budgets shot on C300/FS7, surprisingly only one on Panasonic, 15 on Red and 90 on Arri, mostly Alexa I’d guess.

Yorkchimp said:

One of the projects was a stunning concept that had very important footage that we future proofed by shooting at the highest resolution and quality possible - the subject matter demanded it, again happy to dm about this.

I’d be interested, I’ll drop you a line.

Yorkchimp said:

The OLPFs are changeable and we have used a range of them during a days shoot where low light or skin tones are more important. They aren’t too difficult to change - lens off, 4 screws for lens mounts off and then 4 for the olpf, but you’d be best having a quiet spot on set with a clean mat and a steady hand for the fiddly torx screws. Two people can do it in less than a minute if you are rehearsed at it.

There are some thing which make Red appealing, but this aspect isn’t one of them. The thought of changing them out in the (windy) field doesn’t excite me. Not that I can afford one, but Arri’s ‘best ‘overall' look’, even if it compromises on resolution and low light appeals more than taking the camera to bits.

Yorkchimp said:

The cool thing about the current dsmc2 red cameras is the dual acquisition - 8K raw with simultaneous 4K or 2K prores 422HQ to the same red minimag for proxy workflow and on set preview for client playback. Expect to burn through over 3TB a day if you’re shooting like this though.

On the other hand, the simultaneous raw, prores is very appealing!

Yorkchimp said:

Arri and panavision have gone down the 8k resolution too but they are only available by hire with an astronomical day rate. The panavision one basically has the monstro sensor and red raw acquisition, but a panavision lens mount.

Looks like Arri have finally made it to 4k with their latest announcements, but yes 65 is rental only and 6.5k (correction: 6k) rather than 8k. Aren’t the lens mounts still PL? correction: LPL mount with PL adaptor) But with the larger than ‘full frame’ 24x36 sensor, needing suitably very expensive glass to cover it, like Cooke S7 or Panavision vintage and artiste, which have fall off in sharpness, glare and softer contrast….

https://vimeo.com/253326466

Oh the irony, get the most detailed high res image available, but for the art, bugger it up! But it appeals to me.

Edited by Bacardi on Tuesday 13th February 21:41

[Phunk]

To those in the industry - how did you get in it?

It seems (outside of London at least) to be impossible to find any training courses in the industry, unless you do a full degree.

[Fordo]

Phunk said:

To those in the industry - how did you get in it?

It seems (outside of London at least) to be impossible to find any training courses in the industry, unless you do a full degree.

I work as a DOP on branded content and commercials.

I have no qualifications in film or TV!

I did English at uni. Got into the industry by starting at a production company as a runner, then becoming an AC, trained myself as an editor, went on every short course I could, read everything, watched everything, learned from everyone, became a cam op, worked at a studio doing dop work, ending up directing for a few years- so prett much worked my way up from the bottom.

Still don’t feel like I’m ‘in the industry though’ - I’m outside the unionised film and tv circles, but yet I do get enough work and have regular clients and crew I work with.

It’s definitely about networking and forming good working partnerships with others. You’re right about London though- pretty much most work is there

[GetCarter]

Phunk said:

To those in the industry - how did you get in it?

It seems (outside of London at least) to be impossible to find any training courses in the industry, unless you do a full degree.

https://nfts.co.uk/ Do short courses, as well as diplomas, degrees etc.

I had the opportunity to go there in the 1980s, but chose a different, but related route.

[Phunk]

Cheers chaps.

I currently shoot corporate stuff up in Glasgow for a marketing company. It’s fun, but has no real career to progress in.

I’m debating about if I should jump into the world of film and tv. However it seems to be an industry that’s shrinking, with technology advances and budget constraints, crews are getting smaller.

[Yorkchimp]

Bacardi said:

So similar idea to Imax, but (relatively) cheaper using laser?

Yes - watchout let’s you create a canvas of massive amounts of pixels which you can then split off to multiple projectors or video wall outputs so you end up with 4 HD projectors giving you a 4K image, or more.

The new arri LF looks gorgeous, it’s just priced like an arri piece of kit...high! £125k for the kit, and then you need the lenses too.

[tonyvid]

Phunk said:

To those in the industry - how did you get in it?

It seems (outside of London at least) to be impossible to find any training courses in the industry, unless you do a full degree.

I went into an existing in-house corporate film unit as an apprentice placement in 1983(I was doing electronic engineering at the time and had to really shove to get into the unit) and basically never came out! They were shooting mainly 16mm at the time and just dipping their toes into video production but with no knowledge of the wires and wiggly amp stuff so we were a natural fit. I worked up through all the location disciplines and then moved to the video editing side(after learning the 16mm techniques which are pretty similar to all non-linear software philosophies).

I did a 2 week production course at the BBC, a week at C4 plus some other days here and there - a lot of learning was with outside crews or editing houses in London where I got offered a job but didn't want to quite sell my soul that much. We grew to a unit of about 10 at the peak, slashed to just me as the all-rounder in the early 90s and I've clung on ever since with the same company. I now manage a small in-house team for video and photographic services with the support of some long standing subbies and freelances, some of who were in other video units in different part of my Company across the UK. We are all getting on a bit now...

It's a great profession if you can get in, the tech changes every few years, a good laptop will easily do what a £150k tape suite couldn't not so long ago. The images now are just outstanding, as are the turn around times - we make more in a month now than we did in a year when I first started! We'll not mention the stupid timescales expected from the uninformed...

Anyone fancying getting in shouldn't assume doing TV and Media studies will be enough, that is not the same as Production and just because you can watch films and explain them doesn't mean you can make them!

[Bacardi]

Yorkchimp said:

The new arri LF looks gorgeous, it’s just priced like an arri piece of kit...high! £125k for the kit, and then you need the lenses too.

Or you could buy half a dozen Kinefinity Terra 6ks, a box of ultra primes and still have change for a round the world cruise or two!

But, you get what you pay for….

[Phunk]

A great talk on shooting in 4K & 8K

https://vimeo.com/248235757

[Derek Smith]

Great idea for a thread. It's something which fascinates me. I do a little videoing for SEO purposes and with my rugby club so the level you are talking about would have little practical use for me, but please carry on with it. There's very little on PH on moving pictures. We are staved of interesting threads.

I did a bit on the set of Lovejoy back in the late 80s. All I did was tow cars around for filming. I was enthralled. If I'd had my time again I'd go into TV or movies. It seemed almost magic. The cameraman was treated as one would a god, and a god like Thor, with a big hammer and not afraid to use it.

Thanks for starting this.

[Fordo]

Derek Smith said:

The cameraman was treated as one would a god, and a god like Thor, with a big hammer and not afraid to use it.

I wish it was still like that.....

Now its a bit like this: