To sell or not to sell?
Discussion
I'm thinking about parting with my Roadsport A. I bought it a year and a half ago primarily as a track toy and it's only been on a proper circuit twice since then! I simply don't have the time at the moment and I'm tempted to get something more civilised that can double as transport for business trips, weekends away etc.
So, the question is when to put it on sale? The car is in good mechanical/structural condition but there are a couple of minor odd jobs required: The alternator belt could do with replacing, the car's due for an oil change and it's currently running a somewhat battered secondhand non-catalyst exhaust, which may or may not allow it to pass the MOT emissions requirements once its 3 years post-SVA is up. So I'm debating whether to spend the time doing those or just knock a few quid off the asking price - it's a track-orientated car bearing the 'lived in look' aesthetically so I'm guessing whoever buys it will be good with the spanners anyway.
Secondly, there's simply the matter of timing. I will get even less chance to use it over the winter due to the nature of my job so I'm tempted to put it up now, but I'm conscious that values for sports cars - particularly those with half a hood and no heater - slump somewhat over the winter.
Any thoughts?
So, the question is when to put it on sale? The car is in good mechanical/structural condition but there are a couple of minor odd jobs required: The alternator belt could do with replacing, the car's due for an oil change and it's currently running a somewhat battered secondhand non-catalyst exhaust, which may or may not allow it to pass the MOT emissions requirements once its 3 years post-SVA is up. So I'm debating whether to spend the time doing those or just knock a few quid off the asking price - it's a track-orientated car bearing the 'lived in look' aesthetically so I'm guessing whoever buys it will be good with the spanners anyway.
Secondly, there's simply the matter of timing. I will get even less chance to use it over the winter due to the nature of my job so I'm tempted to put it up now, but I'm conscious that values for sports cars - particularly those with half a hood and no heater - slump somewhat over the winter.
Any thoughts?
Sell racecars now, roadcars in the spring. If it's still in RSA spec it really needs a windscreen, 2 seats/belts and lights to be marketed as a roadcar.
It will need a cat exhaust either as a race or road car now, non-cats are only useful for trackdays. And not that useful at circuits with low noise limits...!!
It will need a cat exhaust either as a race or road car now, non-cats are only useful for trackdays. And not that useful at circuits with low noise limits...!!
No, it's road converted and SVA'd with a windscreen and so on. My comment about it being a circuit spec was more that it has no carpets, no heater etc. and so is more likely to appeal to track day goers than those intending to go touring as a result.
The exhaust is I, believe, a relatively straight swap (IIRC the lambda sensor is on the manifold, so it's literally just a case of unbolting the old one and sticking the new one on?) and might not be needed for road use so I'm not sure I'd be doing anything that someone capable of running the car in the future couldn't do themselves for a corresponding drop in asking price.
The exhaust is I, believe, a relatively straight swap (IIRC the lambda sensor is on the manifold, so it's literally just a case of unbolting the old one and sticking the new one on?) and might not be needed for road use so I'm not sure I'd be doing anything that someone capable of running the car in the future couldn't do themselves for a corresponding drop in asking price.
Chris71 said:
So, the question is when to put it on sale?
To sell or not to sell? Think you've already made your decision. 
Just make sure you won't regret it.
Have hardly driven the Caterham this year and will definitely drive a lot less than I'm used to, after the 'yes' word within a couple of weeks. I'm not planning on selling the Caterham though as I have enjoyed every moment in the car. In these months without, I can't tell you how much I'm missing it. You might want to consider an Elise / Exige / VX as the next best thing, though. Buy something with a bit more comfort than that, and I'll promise you'll be selling that within a year. It's a fact!
allen l said:
Chris71 said:
So, the question is when to put it on sale?
To sell or not to sell? Think you've already made your decision. Just make sure you won't regret it.
Have hardly driven the Caterham this year and will definitely drive a lot less than I'm used to, after the 'yes' word within a couple of weeks. I'm not planning on selling the Caterham though as I have enjoyed every moment in the car. In these months without, I can't tell you how much I'm missing it. You might want to consider an Elise / Exige / VX as the next best thing, though. Buy something with a bit more comfort than that, and I'll promise you'll be selling that within a year. It's a fact!
Two cars back I had an ex-race Sylva Leader which made the Roadsport A look like a Rolls Royce. I then went for a TVR that adminstered much of the same adrenaline hit (albeit rather differently) in a more usable package and that's been my favourite car to date. It was with an exceptionally heavy heart that I sold it, and I only did so because I was doing upwards of a track day a month in a rather shiny (and distinctly road-spec) TVR with fat tyres and lots of cylinders to maintain.
Nothing else I've owned and very few things I've driven comes close to the experience of driving the Caterham on the ragged edge, but I get precious little time to drive it at all, and even less time to drive it like that.
I had considered an Elise, but I reckon it'd still involve most of the compromises of the Caterham for a less full-on driving experience. Instead I've just admitted the next toy needs to be more of a GT so I can find more excuses to use it for general trips rather than just a couple of hours hoonage every so often. I'm undecided, but a Porsche 968 or 944, various classic Alfa coupes and a Lotus Excel are all possibilities.
Chris71 said:
No, it's road converted and SVA'd with a windscreen and so on. My comment about it being a circuit spec was more that it has no carpets, no heater etc. and so is more likely to appeal to track day goers than those intending to go touring as a result.
The exhaust is I, believe, a relatively straight swap (IIRC the lambda sensor is on the manifold, so it's literally just a case of unbolting the old one and sticking the new one on?) and might not be needed for road use so I'm not sure I'd be doing anything that someone capable of running the car in the future couldn't do themselves for a corresponding drop in asking price.
Aha, it's an "old spec" ex-RSA rather than the "new RSA" which used to be called "Roadsport Inters". Confusing, I know... In which case it should have toys like 6-speed and ZF LSD as standard, which will appeal to road and track users alike.The exhaust is I, believe, a relatively straight swap (IIRC the lambda sensor is on the manifold, so it's literally just a case of unbolting the old one and sticking the new one on?) and might not be needed for road use so I'm not sure I'd be doing anything that someone capable of running the car in the future couldn't do themselves for a corresponding drop in asking price.
If it's got the original RSA exhaust it will be a 4-branch manifold into a 4-1 collector and silencer, and if it's an EU2 (pre-01) it may not need an emissions check at MOT time? I'm pretty sure the 2001 and on EU3s do though and thus either have to fit a separate Cat box or change the manifold for the standard one and get the Caterham exhaust with the built-in Cat.
Tbh I would sell it in the spring when more people will be looking and prices stronger. Selling anything for the road in autumn/winter is always more difficult as people don't want to pay the road tax/insurance/MOT etc for a car they probably won't use for more than a day or two before April.
BertBert said:
you can't sell it Chris. We went through a lot of angst to get that car, just get out and drive it!
Bert
Trust me, I'd love to. The problem is I'm so busy I rarely get a chance to drive anywhere without having to ferry around work stuff, weekend luggage and/or the girlfriend (who refuses to get into the Caterham!)Bert
I'm adamant I need three cars: A sensible, practical shed, a long distance sports GT and a firery track car.
The problem is without the space or budget for all three I have to admit I'd get by far the most use out of the first two.
coyoteracer11 said:
Chris71 said:
No, it's road converted and SVA'd with a windscreen and so on. My comment about it being a circuit spec was more that it has no carpets, no heater etc. and so is more likely to appeal to track day goers than those intending to go touring as a result.
The exhaust is I, believe, a relatively straight swap (IIRC the lambda sensor is on the manifold, so it's literally just a case of unbolting the old one and sticking the new one on?) and might not be needed for road use so I'm not sure I'd be doing anything that someone capable of running the car in the future couldn't do themselves for a corresponding drop in asking price.
Aha, it's an "old spec" ex-RSA rather than the "new RSA" which used to be called "Roadsport Inters". Confusing, I know... In which case it should have toys like 6-speed and ZF LSD as standard, which will appeal to road and track users alike.The exhaust is I, believe, a relatively straight swap (IIRC the lambda sensor is on the manifold, so it's literally just a case of unbolting the old one and sticking the new one on?) and might not be needed for road use so I'm not sure I'd be doing anything that someone capable of running the car in the future couldn't do themselves for a corresponding drop in asking price.
If it's got the original RSA exhaust it will be a 4-branch manifold into a 4-1 collector and silencer, and if it's an EU2 (pre-01) it may not need an emissions check at MOT time? I'm pretty sure the 2001 and on EU3s do though and thus either have to fit a separate Cat box or change the manifold for the standard one and get the Caterham exhaust with the built-in Cat.
Tbh I would sell it in the spring when more people will be looking and prices stronger. Selling anything for the road in autumn/winter is always more difficult as people don't want to pay the road tax/insurance/MOT etc for a car they probably won't use for more than a day or two before April.
I might advertise it in its current state - warts and all - and then take it off the market over the winter and do the exhaust conversion etc. if it fails to sell.
Chris71 said:
Speaking of which, bit of a numptie question, but how do I confirm it has the larger brakes? The original advert claimed they were and I've got no reason to doubt it, but I want to double check before putting it up.
The callipers should have AP Racing stamped on them if they are big brakes, the pads are a different size and shape to the standard ones, and you may also have the uprated vented discs (standard discs are solid). Just take the wheels off and have a look...You may also have the uprated AP Master Cylinder too, have a look for that under the bonnet.
Sounds like a good spec car, the original RSAs were the top-spec Caterham race cars for a while. Check your Minister invoices for forged pistons as well, if it had any rebuild work past 2003.
I keep thinking about selling mine as well but each time its out on track (only twice this year), Spa on Monday, I realise I can't really part with it. Road use is a minimal as either the roads are busy or I can't get over the bumps at work. The only car I would consider is an Elise (had one before) but it doesn't do it for me on track. All round I probably accept its the better choice though. Would love to own both.
In terms of selling it you may find there is someone out there waiting for the exact car. If there isn't and it doesn't shift quickly then sit on it and try again in the spring. I sold my 7 in Autumn and the perfect replacement turned up in snowy February. The guy was surprised he sold it within a day of advertising but it was the ideal spec.
If you do sell and as BertBert says I'll look forward to reading about the search for your next toy.
In terms of selling it you may find there is someone out there waiting for the exact car. If there isn't and it doesn't shift quickly then sit on it and try again in the spring. I sold my 7 in Autumn and the perfect replacement turned up in snowy February. The guy was surprised he sold it within a day of advertising but it was the ideal spec.
If you do sell and as BertBert says I'll look forward to reading about the search for your next toy.
allen l said:
Chris, ask your girl if she'd consider getting in an Atom.
Fortunately she wouldn't know what one was.
I, on the other hand, am still mildly tingling from my experiences of doing some work on the early Atom 2s when I was a student getting on for a decade ago. Even after upping my personal horsepower record to 630bhp earlier this year the Atom still remains my benchmark for accelerative savagery!
I think the only time i'll sell my seven is to buy another one! It helps that I finished paying for it a while back and also the fact that its probably worth the same now as I paid for it 3 years ago. It's relatively cheap to maintain and insure, delivers massive driving thrills even with only 115bhp or thereabouts and the vast majority of people have no envious / malicious feelings towards it. A great car.
Ecosseven said:
It's relatively cheap to maintain and insure, delivers massive driving thrills even with only 115bhp or thereabouts and the vast majority of people have no envious / malicious feelings towards it. A great car.
All very good points. The Caterham seems to produce by far the most positive response of any car I've owned. The TVR perhaps turned more heads, but even in the south east it's uncanny how many people let you out of junctions or wave you past when you catch them up on a B-road if you're driving a Seven; it's interesting enough to get noticed but somehow seen as down to earth enough to avoid jealousy I think. I'd also miss the parts availability and how easy it is to get to everything. And it's unlikely that something bigger and more sensible would encourage me to exit every quiet T-junction sideways. The thing is, though, I can count the number of times I drove it this summer on my fingers. Something OH-friendly with a roof and a decent boot would go out several times a week. I freely admit it'd be a case of administering a more diluted thrill, but doing so more often.
Chris,
It'll come as no surprise to a few of our very close friends I've been muttering Morgan Speedster or Aero8 recently. Now there's -0- wrong with our very well looked after Caterham SV-VHPD, in fact for the 8 years we've owned BB^3 it's been the dogs danglies in every weather and country we've had it in. Am I bored with it, I'm not sure -- there's something telling me "respray a flawless car, add some new carbon, and take the value she's got and buy a Morgan". I am just not getting out like I used to, can't figure out why as we're empty nesters now, but perhaps with a Scooby WRX for a work car, I need something more gentile?
There are those who would / will mock me, but a Morgan Speedster with the V-6 a seriously good car, or the V-8 version of same. For about 1/3 - 1/2 more than the current value of our well looked after SV-VHPD I can buy a quite recent (last 3-4 years) version. The thing that works in it's favour is several-fold: hard roof for winter, wider interior/creature comforts, equivalent power, good owners club.
What works against it is am I really going to look old @ 50, considering I have not-so-much grey hair? Do I give a monkey's t*ss about that -- absolutely not as I'm proud to be an anorak. There's just something about the gentle burbling of a proper V-8 or 6 as we had in our Cerbie that we miss, not that the sheer sound of audio terror from our exhaust doesn't have it's own unique sound.
Considering we're looking to buy 1 last house (famous last words probably) trading to a higher-end / Bhp Morgan would fit well into plans to be debt free in the next several years, yet still have a reasonable stable value car for all the fun we've had all over the world in our Se7en.
Really stuck as the Se7en being long-ago paid off is just road tax and insurance these days. Do I want to incur debt when I am down to just a house payment may sway me one way or the other.
Just to let you know you're far from alone with this kind of thought. Am I being impure to the British car industry if I leave the Caterham for a Morgan -- absolutely not. I'd actually be going further back then than growing up with my Dad restoring old British cars by buying one.
I've yet to take one for a spin -- I know they're not the same chasis/characteristics, but it you read their forums it's not hard to have just as much, if not more in a great car.
So I have been told I can't buy one if I decide to until after we buy a house, and have a kitchen put in. But I am really thinking this over hard right now.
It'll come as no surprise to a few of our very close friends I've been muttering Morgan Speedster or Aero8 recently. Now there's -0- wrong with our very well looked after Caterham SV-VHPD, in fact for the 8 years we've owned BB^3 it's been the dogs danglies in every weather and country we've had it in. Am I bored with it, I'm not sure -- there's something telling me "respray a flawless car, add some new carbon, and take the value she's got and buy a Morgan". I am just not getting out like I used to, can't figure out why as we're empty nesters now, but perhaps with a Scooby WRX for a work car, I need something more gentile?
There are those who would / will mock me, but a Morgan Speedster with the V-6 a seriously good car, or the V-8 version of same. For about 1/3 - 1/2 more than the current value of our well looked after SV-VHPD I can buy a quite recent (last 3-4 years) version. The thing that works in it's favour is several-fold: hard roof for winter, wider interior/creature comforts, equivalent power, good owners club.
What works against it is am I really going to look old @ 50, considering I have not-so-much grey hair? Do I give a monkey's t*ss about that -- absolutely not as I'm proud to be an anorak. There's just something about the gentle burbling of a proper V-8 or 6 as we had in our Cerbie that we miss, not that the sheer sound of audio terror from our exhaust doesn't have it's own unique sound.
Considering we're looking to buy 1 last house (famous last words probably) trading to a higher-end / Bhp Morgan would fit well into plans to be debt free in the next several years, yet still have a reasonable stable value car for all the fun we've had all over the world in our Se7en.
Really stuck as the Se7en being long-ago paid off is just road tax and insurance these days. Do I want to incur debt when I am down to just a house payment may sway me one way or the other.
Just to let you know you're far from alone with this kind of thought. Am I being impure to the British car industry if I leave the Caterham for a Morgan -- absolutely not. I'd actually be going further back then than growing up with my Dad restoring old British cars by buying one.
I've yet to take one for a spin -- I know they're not the same chasis/characteristics, but it you read their forums it's not hard to have just as much, if not more in a great car.
So I have been told I can't buy one if I decide to until after we buy a house, and have a kitchen put in. But I am really thinking this over hard right now.
Edited by Steve-B on Saturday 2nd October 17:06
I can empaphise with that. I've had a couple of brief experiences of Morgan - an old school Plus 4 at one end of the scale and an Aeromax at the other - and I'd love one if money was no object. In reality, for me personally, it'd only be a 9th or 10th addition to the fantasy garage after I win the lottery!
Back to reality, I'm now more or less certain I'm going to start looking for a good Lotus Excel SE. At least that retains some Seven DNA along with its comfort and its practicality, so I won't be completely abandoning my principles.
Back to reality, I'm now more or less certain I'm going to start looking for a good Lotus Excel SE. At least that retains some Seven DNA along with its comfort and its practicality, so I won't be completely abandoning my principles.
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