Helical versus straight cut Seq box???

[Walton]

For several reasons I'm upgrading my H-box to the 6-speed Quaife 60G sequential.

This is now available with helical or straight cut gears. One of the reasons I initially went for for the H-box was the straight-cut was so clattery on tick-over and whined loudly when driving. The helical cut is meant to be much quieter and less jerky in operation, but Caterham reckon it's not as nice when going for it (Quaife say they should be barely any difference).

Before committing, has anyone had experience of both boxes, as it's a lot of cash!

Cheers

R

[Tango7]

Can't answer your query on the G60 but have you thought/considered the Sadev box. As you say, its a lot of money so this might be an option. A chap on BC has just been through the decision making process between the two makes and is going for the Sadev which is partly based on it being used in the Levante and Atom.

http://www.blatchat.com/t.asp?id=192116

[mic]

The helical box is quieter, should make no difference to the change. Ratios may be slightly different.

[thequietone]

Have driven both and yes, the helical was quieter but I have to say I did notice the difference in the change. The helical seemed to shift without as much shunt and clunking at lower rpm but the straight cut swapped ratios in a more seamless fashion higher up the revs and on track. Might just be me but clutchless upshifts (with a small lift) seemed faster and smoother with the dog box. If the car's main domain is circuit and fast road I'd go straight cut again with no hesitation.

Edited by thequietone on Friday 17th September 09:49

[edb49]

Walton said:

For several reasons I'm upgrading my H-box to the 6-speed Quaife 60G sequential.

This is now available with helical or straight cut gears. One of the reasons I initially went for for the H-box was the straight-cut was so clattery on tick-over and whined loudly when driving. The helical cut is meant to be much quieter and less jerky in operation, but Caterham reckon it's not as nice when going for it (Quaife say they should be barely any difference).

Before committing, has anyone had experience of both boxes, as it's a lot of cash!

Cheers

R

Helical gears are quieter, and transfer less power than straight cut. (You lose maybe 1-2% power from helical gears.)

Either option from Quaife will be dog engagement; this is the thing that really affects how quick it is to swap gears.

I'm in Berks if you fancy a ride in a car with the straight cut box.

[MadHatter7]

The Sadev 6 speed sequential is much better than the Quaife
And the gears are straight cut but about the same noise as the semi helical Quaife
Service is miles better too, speak to Steve @ SWR Motorsport in Harlow

[MadHatter7]

For a perfect shift just add a flat shift gcu from Geartronics, its only £200
And the Sadev comes complete with digital display and loom etc
So by the time you compare the two there is only £200 between them
Sadev won hands down and Russell Savory only uses them now
I had a spin in his latest creation the RSW EVO, 600 bhp of supercharged V6 with A Sadev, Paddle shift form Geartronics and only 720 kgs
The Sadev and shift was amazing and as for the V6 i am saving

[Walton]

Thanks.

I'll give SWR a bell. I've also spoke to Geartronics, and they say the Quaife box is very tricky to setup with their Flat Shift. Apparently their Pneumatic Paddle Shift is only designed for racing i.e. maximum rpm and would be awful for road use - Expensive too at £4k+ vat!

For various reasons I can get the Quaife box & fitting at cost price so it may prove much cheaper.

Rich

[MadHatter7]

I was in the RS Performance Exige with the paddle shift, no problems.
The flatshift is a must in my opinion to protect your investment and get down the road even quicker
The Sadev is still head & shoulders above the Quaife, all the rally drivers are switching to Sadev
Dont forget the Sadev is plug and play for the flatshifter
Guess you pay your money and make your choice

[fergus]

MadHatter7 said:

I was in the RS Performance Exige with the paddle shift, no problems.
The flatshift is a must in my opinion to protect your investment and get down the road even quicker
The Sadev is still head & shoulders above the Quaife, all the rally drivers are switching to Sadev
Dont forget the Sadev is plug and play for the flatshifter
Guess you pay your money and make your choice

for Sadev. I raced a Clio Cup car for 2 years, which was fitted with a Sadev box (serviced by Steve Waudby @ SWR). The built in flatshift sensor on the box I used (can't recall the model) was superb.

Most "off the shelf" junior WRC cars offered for sale by the manufacturers, (peugeot, citroen, etc) come with Sadev boxes. It's been this way for quite a while. This is not a new thing.

for Neil Wallace @ Geartronics. Very knowledgable and enthusiastic guy, who will work with you rather than just complete the GCU sale, then walk away, as per some other unnamed "GCU" manufacturers.

[Atomic Gibbon]

Having experienced it, I would not want to own a road car with the quaife straight cut sequential. It made driving all day uncomfortable, not fun.
It would be awesome for a track though, where you;re always helmeted and poss with ear plugs.

[Walton]

When people say it's a better box, what do they mean i.e. more reliable/stronger, quicker shifting?

[taffyracer]

MadHatter7 said:

The Sadev is still head & shoulders above the Quaife, all the rally drivers are switching to Sadev
Dont forget the Sadev is plug and play for the flatshifter
Guess you pay your money and make your choice

Carl, i don't think that it is true, different Yes but I also researched them heavily before plumping for a Quaife and in reality I don't think there is anything in it really other than the Sadev being a tad cheaper, they are both quality products. The Geartronics system is not tricky at all with the Quaife, it works without issue and it was Neil Wallace that recommended that I stick with the Quaife for this very reason, its tried and tested, there are only a handful of Sadev's in a 7 whilst there are a few hundered Quaife's already installed, that might have a bearing on which direction the OP decides to go, i also think the Quaife might be a preferred route for resale.

Helical is the way to go for road use, straight cut if it's more track focussed

[taffyracer]

fergus said:

MadHatter7 said:

for Neil Wallace @ Geartronics. Very knowledgable and enthusiastic guy, who will work with you rather than just complete the GCU sale, then walk away, as per some other unnamed "GCU" manufacturers.

100% agree, he drove down from Sheffield to Kent to help sort out my configuration issues, top man

[MadHatter7]

Dom it looks like Neil has changed his mind as last time i spoke to him re gearboxes he said if t was his money he would go for the Sadev
After speaking with Steve at SWR Motorsport and Russell Savory i am happy with my choice
The thing that swayed it for me too was the poor customer service from Quaife and the first class service from SWR and Sadev
The Levante has not broken a Sadev yet

[Walton]

Thanks for the advice.

Think I'm going to go for a Quaife straight-cut as I can get this £2k cheaper than the Sadev (Caterham also say they wouldn't support it, and given I'm still in warranty it could prove an issue).

When I spoke to Neil at Geartronics the other day, he said that the Quaife was tricky to flat-shift as the gear-lever needed a sensor sandwiching in it (a very tricky task apparently), and then the gear-lever becomes too long. He said the only way to do it would be to have Quaife make up a special 2-part gear-lever with a bend in it and the sensor sandwiched - they did it for a customer a few years back apparently.

Cheers

Rich

[slight500]

I've got the Quaife in my car.It's a nice enough box but I agree with MadHatter about the service side of things.From parts , sales ,right up to the manager I would rate it poor at best! Also I cant believe Quaife have never managed to fit a couple of switches inside the box for a flatshift.One of the guys I race with is designing his own flatshift and it doesn't look that difficult a job.

[mickrick]

Just to even things up a bit. I bought my complete diff from Quaife, and the service was very good. They did send me the wrong thing initialy, but a quick call, and it was dealt with very quickly.
But, I won't be going for a Quaife gearbox. If I had a choice between Quaife, and Sadev, my money would be with Sadev. But I'm going for neither at the moment. I may be going the Drenth route. But it's way out of Sadev or Quaife price range, so I doubt you'd want to consider it.

[taffyracer]

ooh drenth, very nice.....I agree the Quaife customer service wasn't great, they messed up my invoicing and then overcharged me and I had to fight to get a refund but the box is great, the quaife gearstick is a £60 mod, basically they cut the shaft in 2, tap each end and screw in a load cell in between 2 halves, it does elongate the gearstick but tbh I actually prefer it longer so its not an issue for me, its by no means complicated and quaife know all about it and you can also order an angled gearstick from the off so its no big deal, with flatshift it is superb and worth every penny on track, but for a road car I wouldn't bother, a slight lift off the power slots the gears in instantly anyway. The sadev looks great value but the lack of caterham support and relatively few people running them was the reason I opted for the Quaife, carl you're going to have to let me have a go next time at Llandow mate;)

[MadHatter7]

Mick i can see a Drenth in the next car