R400 - setup advice

[Walton]

Hi everyone

I'm pleased to be collecting my 1st Caterham tomorrow - the blue R400 Duratec advertised on PH.

I'm going to run it for 3-4 months alongside my Atom before deciding to go for a full-spec R500 with seq etc.

Firstly i assume its best to ditch the 15"s for 13"s for track use? I'm planning on running a set of ACB10s alongside a set of CR500s.

Could someone reccomend somewhere in the midlands that really knows how to set up Cat well for track use?

Cheers

Rich

[rejn]

I had my race R400 set up by Caterham Midland and they did a pretty good job. I've heard mixed reviews from others, though, but for me, they did well.

[Nicodema]

Bear in mind that the ACB10s and the CR500s do have different camber requirements.

[jimmyslr]

The new Avon ZZR is supposed to be the track tyre of choice (and road legal) these days. The joy of it is that is a radial like your CR500s so no messing around with set-up; it's one on one off

Some say you can switch from ACB10s to CR500s and whilst it is true, if you are pushing on at a trachk you will be heavily compromised one way or another.

James

[James.S]

Fauldsport, they are in Hixon, Staffs.

http://www.fauldsport.com/

[Walton]

Thanks everyone.

Fauldsport or DPR can't book in for a month. Think I'll try Caterham Midlands.

I spoke to BMTR Tyres and they say the Avon ZZR won't be available for up to a month. Fauldsport reckoned the ZZR is only okay and slicks would be the way to go, DPR reckon the ZZR would be the way to go. It's available in 2 compounds - sprint/hillclimb and circuit.

I don't want to go to the cost and trouble to run a 2nd set of ZZRs though if they're only marginly better than the CR500s!
No-one seems to run A048s or R888s on Caterhams - I run them on the Atom (soft front, med rear) and they're pretty good, though too stiff to get heat into most of the time.

ACB10s can be got used nice and cheap, compared to £1k for a new set of slicks, the ZZRs will be around £450.

Another question is what size tyre widths do people go for with non-standard tyres. I don't want to upset the balance by going too wide. I'm getting some CXRs made up, is it best to stick with the 6" & 8" rims or go a bit wider?

Cheers

Rich

[Murph7355]

I'd wait a month.

Edited to add - and get 13"ers on it.

Edited by Murph7355 on Monday 26th April 19:49

[Nicodema]

Oh, hi Rich. I've just realised we met at Bedford on the 3rd. Alex (my girlfriend) and I were "running in" GRR, the orange R300 that we'd recently finished building.

Great to see that you're getting the Caterham. It'll be interesting to see what you reckon, side by side with the Atom.

BTW, were Fauldsport talking about the new ZZR or the old one? The new one's a completely different beast. Much improved apparently, lighter and more flexible for the Seven. I'm thinking of getting a set of 13"s and putting ZZRs on once they become a bit easier to get hold of.

Edited by Nicodema on Monday 26th April 23:43

[Walton]

Nicodema said:

Oh, hi Rich. I've just realised we met at Bedford on the 3rd. Alex (my girlfriend) and I were "running in" GRR, the orange R300 that we'd recently finished building.

Great to see that you're getting the Caterham. It'll be interesting to see what you reckon, side by side with the Atom.

BTW, were Fauldsport talking about the new ZZR or the old one? The new one's a completely different beast. Much improved apparently, lighter and more flexible for the Seven. I'm thinking of getting a set of 13"s and putting ZZRs on once they become a bit easier to get hold of.

Edited by Nicodema on Monday 26th April 23:43

Hi again! Was at Bedford again today - great fun.

If there was an old ZZR, that makes sense. Fauldsport insisted they'd used them lots in the past! DPR said they'd spoken to some testers and the upcoming version was meant to be very very good.

Decision made - saved me a few quid too.

[Shaun_E]

Walton said:

No-one seems to run A048s or R888s on Caterhams

Lots of people run these tyres. The general consensus (bearing in mind that everyone has their own opinion) is that, of the two, R888s are the better road tyre while A048Rs are the better track tyre. For track work use R888 GG/2G compound or A048R medium.
A lot of sprinters/hillclimbers (myself included) use Kumho Ecsta V70A in soft or supersoft for competition and then a set of medium or hard for track and road so no need to alter set up. I use hards for track as some fellow competitors have tried medium and they go off after only a few laps.

I know of a few people who use second hand slicks for track. I would be tempted down this route and keep CR500s for road use (IMO they are the best all round road tyre for a Caterham).

Whatever you choose you are unlikely to be disappointed as they are all decent tyres - I have tried all of them and none were terrible. I will be sticking with Kumho V70A for the time being as they suit my needs. They do need lost of -ve camber on the front though (at least 2.5 degrees).

If the ZZR finally arrives in a supersoft compound then I am sure the sprint and hillclimb fraternity will try them.

Edited by Shaun_E on Tuesday 27th April 09:32

[fergus]

Shaun_E said:

They do need lost of +ve camber on the front though (at least 2.5 degrees).

+ve?

[Shaun_E]

fergus said:

Shaun_E said:

They do need lost of +ve camber on the front though (at least 2.5 degrees).

+ve?

Oops - a bit early in the morning for my poor tired brain - that should of course read -ve and I have now corrected it. Best I give up trying to give technical advice as I am only going to confuse people :-)

[James.S]

A few sets have been passed round the R300 competitors but as far as i am aware no one has done enough testing to iron out a setup. It may be a dry option tyre for next year but not convinced.

Why don't you want it on CR500? They work in the wet and the dry very well. The cars I have driven with yoks etc all have too much grip in the dry nad are pants in the wet.

Also, there is a reason that FS and DPR can't fit you in for a month.....i would wait.

[Murph7355]

James.S said:

...
Also, there is a reason that FS and DPR can't fit you in for a month.....i would wait.

Listen to this man

[Walton]

Thanks all.

I've booked it into Caterham midlands for next Tues for 13"ers with some Cr500s and a more aggressive geo.
I'll also book it into Fauldsport or DPR for next month - by then I'll have had chance to do a trackday or 2 and have a better idea of what setup I want.

Having got the car home, and thought it felt quite spacious, I've worked out that I've actually bought an SV! The last owner didn't know much about the spec (playtoy that didn't suit him), so no-ones to blame.

Car's certainly a bit nicer to get in and out, and with the leather seats/screen will be a nice daily drive when the weathers good. Pedals are further apart which make normal shoes work well, but heel&toe is a bit trickier!

First blat impressions are very good. Suspension feels incredibly soft/supple (I run very hard suspension on the Atom to compensate for lack of ARBs). Much much slower in a straight line than the Atom, but flows better with more consistant entry/apex/exit pace , and the engine bark at the red-line is fantastic

I know the SV is a few kg heavier and slightly longer wheelbase (and wider track?). Will it be radically different to the classic/narrowbody on track, and will it still be as quick/fun and give me a good idea of what to expect from a narrowbody when I have my new car built?

Thanks

Rich

[Walton]

Having said all above, I'm now not sure if it's an SV or not!

Can anyone tell from the photos here: http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/1651576.htm

[Murph7355]

Walton said:

Having said all above, I'm now not sure if it's an SV or not!

Can anyone tell from the photos here: http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/1651576.htm

It's a non-SV chassis.

Little point paying Caterham Midlands to set it up then getting Fauldsport to do it again. I'd just use it as you have it now, though if it's straight from the factory it's unlikely to handle that nicely.

[Walton]

Cheers, I've now measured it and you're right - a non-SV. Must be a combination of lowered floors and leather seats seeming spacious compared to the Tillets.

I want to get 13"s on ASAP (initial impressions are the 15"s really seem to tramline badly under braking, and although a strange comparison, the Factory reckon the difference in performance is "similar to going from a R300 to R500"), so it'll need setting up for these anyway. Car feels quite a bit less direct that the roadsport demo with s/l suspension I took out last week. It hasn't been set-up since new and is a road focused car.

[Nicodema]

Easiest way to tell at a glance is the SV has 11 popstuds across the top of the windscreen, the S3 has only 7. One looks like too many, the other looks like too few

[Murph7355]

Nicodema said:

Easiest way to tell at a glance is the SV has 11 popstuds across the top of the windscreen, the S3 has only 7. One looks like too many, the other looks like too few

Also, the cockpits are usually littered with Greggs bags, and the cars tend to lean toward the driver's side