R500 delivered, yay!

[edb49]

Picked up my R500 from the Caterham factory last Friday but had to go away almost immediately. Came back today and was really excited and looking forward to driving the new toy. Unfortunately it was raining when I got home, so I took the car out and got wet. New expensive car, revvy engine, wet roads... certainly keeps the mind focussed.

It's a really good car. The sequential box is a must-have for the full-on raw experience, it puts a grin on your face even when you're going slowly.

I spoke to the guy at Caterham who handed the car over to me and he said I should show it some degree of mechanical sympathy during running in but no need to bumble around at 3000rpm, he said you can use all the revs just exercise common sense.

If I am brutally honest, it's not as quick as I expected. I was expecting it to feel quicker than the GT-R (which has a new exhaust/remap, so ~560bhp) but there is something about the power delivery in the GT-R which gives such a sense of speed. (E.G. Lots of torque on demand, rather than needing 6k rpm to get going.) In terms of getting from A to B on British roads the GT-R is massively quicker too... at least in my hands.

It is interesting seeing how the R500 delivers its performance, the close ratio box means you can use 1st gear to come out of slow corners which is the first time I've ever had that in a road car. Also after driving down a bumpy road in the Caterham and the GT-R it's a revelation; where I was grimmacing and holding on in the GT-R because it was skipping across the bumps, the Caterham just soaks them up and is on another level. Obviously it's a third of the weight which contributes.

Final thing is the shift lights. They seem to come on much too early in my view, can you configure these at all?

[fergus]

edb49 said:

it's not as quick as I expected. I was expecting it to feel quicker than the GT-R (which has a new exhaust/remap, so ~560bhp) but there is something about the power delivery in the GT-R which gives such a sense of speed. (E.G. Lots of torque on demand, rather than needing 6k rpm to get going.) In terms of getting from A to B on British roads the GT-R is massively quicker too... at least in my hands.

I'm surprised. If you feel the same after a full bore drive in the dry I'd be stunned! The power to weight of the car, combined with the low mass, and hence low inertia will allow massive in gear acceleration, which combined with the 'near' flat shift capability of the Quaife box must be awesome!

Can you do another post on your thoughts after a drive in the dry?

Speak to Caterham re the shift lights?

[edb49]

fergus said:

edb49 said:

it's not as quick as I expected. I was expecting it to feel quicker than the GT-R (which has a new exhaust/remap, so ~560bhp) but there is something about the power delivery in the GT-R which gives such a sense of speed. (E.G. Lots of torque on demand, rather than needing 6k rpm to get going.) In terms of getting from A to B on British roads the GT-R is massively quicker too... at least in my hands.

I'm surprised. If you feel the same after a full bore drive in the dry I'd be stunned! The power to weight of the car, combined with the low mass, and hence low inertia will allow massive in gear acceleration, which combined with the 'near' flat shift capability of the Quaife box must be awesome!

Can you do another post on your thoughts after a drive in the dry?

I think the perceptive side of it is if you put your foot down in the Caterham at 3k rpm, then you probably get 50% of peak torque - but in the Nissan it is more like 90%. So probably Caterham would feel quicker if you held it at a constant 7k rpm and then planted it, but I've not tried that.

[fergus]

edb49 said:

fergus said:

edb49 said:

it's not as quick as I expected. I was expecting it to feel quicker than the GT-R (which has a new exhaust/remap, so ~560bhp) but there is something about the power delivery in the GT-R which gives such a sense of speed. (E.G. Lots of torque on demand, rather than needing 6k rpm to get going.) In terms of getting from A to B on British roads the GT-R is massively quicker too... at least in my hands.

I'm surprised. If you feel the same after a full bore drive in the dry I'd be stunned! The power to weight of the car, combined with the low mass, and hence low inertia will allow massive in gear acceleration, which combined with the 'near' flat shift capability of the Quaife box must be awesome!

Can you do another post on your thoughts after a drive in the dry?

I think the perceptive side of it is if you put your foot down in the Caterham at 3k rpm, then you probably get 50% of peak torque - but in the Nissan it is more like 90%. So probably Caterham would feel quicker if you held it at a constant 7k rpm and then planted it, but I've not tried that.

very trick quick spooling turbos and engine mgmt on the GT-R will give it monstrous low down grunt. Wait for the sun, then take the 7 out >>>>>>

[fatvik]

Hi Ed
One of the guys at work has the GT-R; I keep meaning to go out for a drive with him to see how it compares it to the Caterham. I suspect the Nissan is more usable in more environments than the Cat..

I am surprised that you found the Caterham soaked up the bumps, for me the Caterham (on certain roads) seems really skittish when compared to my little civic

I'd be interested (the same as fergus) in what you have to say when you try the cars in the dry and also perhaps when you track them.
Hope you enjoy the ownership of both of your cars
-FatVik

[jackal]

once you start leaning on the brakes properly, flicking it into bends, redlining every gear etc.. and undersatnding the real-world quickness of the R500 (as opposed to any gear, any revs straight line grunt) i'm sure the word fast will take on a new meaning for you

on circuit it will totally monster the GT-r.. to give you an idea, autocar recently did a GT-r vs. bike comparison at cadwell. The GT-r managed 1.43 or thereabouts which is pretty much a Graduate 120bhp catreham time. A duratec R500 would be close to 1.30 !

Edited by jackal on Tuesday 20th October 22:17

[thequietone]

So how many revs have been used so far then?

[atom-ick]

As everyone is saying, wait until the sun comes out and you can use all the power. I have driven both GT-R and an R500 (although it was an older K Series one), as well as having owned R400's and Atoms and i was dissapointed with the GT-R! They are quick if you are a lazy driver (eg don;t bother to change down before booting it), but surely the whole point of a lightweight sports car is that you get stuck in and work the car.

As a further demonstration of the performance differential, a copy of EVO happens to be sat next to my desk (as if there isn;t always a copy of evo next to my desk!) and around their test circuit, the R500 recorded a time of 1.202 and the GT-R pulled off a 1.23.6, making it 3.4 seconds per lap slower. Now, i know that around the ring it would be one sided in the GT-R's favour, but that is only down to the massive straights and the higher top speed (not to mention a mentally unstable test driver with balls the size of coconuts).

to give you a feel for the difference in times, again around the same circuit a porsche boxster is about the same gap backwards from a GT-R (1.28) as the GT-R is from the R500.

basically, the GT-R is a very fast car in a straight line, but to me that is almost irrelevant as real driving doesn;t involve motorways!

They are both good cars but i'm sure you'll change your mind once you've got used to driving the R500.

[Graham E]

EDB,

First, congrats on the car - they're utterly, utterly awesome.
2nd, I hate to say it, but read the book - the lights come on from factory at silly rpm (4.5k as I recall), and do your head in. A few buttons later, and the lights come on 750 rpm below change up point, quickly - much better. You can choose your own settings, obviously.

Once you have it run in, I'm sure you'll change your stance re. speed - the duratec has decent drivable torque down low, but becomes a raging animal at the upper third of the rev range. I've never been in a GT-R, but it'd have to be one hell of a beast to be R500 style exhilirating.

Hope you enjoy every minute of it,
G

PS - that box is a loud bugger, eh?

[GFWilliams]

Hi Ed,

Congrats on the new car
When are you posting up some pictures then?

Having been in your GT-R and been scared stless and also having been in a 250bhp caterham I can sort of understand why you are saying this. The GT-R is truly savage - it just goes! A Caterham is so much more raw though and quite a bit better through the corners. Have you got an aeroscreen? if not, get an interchangable one - you'll not turn back

George

[edb49]

Graham E said:

2nd, I hate to say it, but read the book - the lights come on from factory at silly rpm (4.5k as I recall), and do your head in. A few buttons later, and the lights come on 750 rpm below change up point, quickly - much better. You can choose your own settings, obviously.

Thanks for the tip Graham... I did read through the book but couldn't find anything about the shift lights. I'll have another look through as I must have missed it.

Graham E said:

PS - that box is a loud bugger, eh?

Yes, lots of good noise...

[edb49]

thequietone said:

So how many revs have been used so far then?

8.4kpm so far, but have only done it once or twice as per the "not going crazy" advice from Caterham. Definitely a very cammy engine.

I'll find a friend and a quite dual carriageway to do a 20-70mph comparison of the GT-R and R500. I think it would be quite interesting; the Nissan will almost certainly get the jump but maybe the R500 will catch up.

[edb49]

GFWilliams said:

When are you posting up some pictures then?

Having been in your GT-R and been scared stless and also having been in a 250bhp caterham I can sort of understand why you are saying this. The GT-R is truly savage - it just goes! A Caterham is so much more raw though and quite a bit better through the corners. Have you got an aeroscreen? if not, get an interchangable one - you'll not turn back

Hi George

I'll put up some photos this weekend, though not of the same quality as yours! Might be interesting seeing it next to a (much) bigger car like the GT-R.

I didn't go for the aeroscreen in the end although it was on the original order. I came to the conclusion I'd be too scared about taking passengers and having stones flick up and scar them. I'm thinking about stuff like my cousin who has a 7yr old son who loves cars, I want to take him out and give him the full experience without bringing him back scarred for life.

[edb49]

Here are some photos of the R500 vs. GT-R size:

http://www.getdropbox.com/gallery/473116/2/_To%20C...

Sorry about photo quality... I had to take them in the rain without time to clean the GT-R, about to go to a wedding.

[ForzaGilles]

Good choice of colour, orange with bare carbon wings,same as my Superlight Your's has slightly more poke though.... Enjoy

[Graham E]

I'd say you've done the right thing re. aero screen - with that, you really need a helmet, and a helmet means you can't chat to your passenger, or hear the engine as well.

[fatvik]

I was expecting the Nissan to really tower over the Cat.... lovely cars tho

[Tango7]

Graham E said:

I'd say you've done the right thing re. aero screen - with that, you really need a helmet, and a helmet means you can't chat to your passenger, or hear the engine as well.

I reckon the helmet just about makes driving in the R500 with a sequential box bearable and that's with ear plugs in! Even with a windscreen, I don't think there will be much chatting between the occupants unless you have an intercom...

[edb49]

Graham E said:

I'd say you've done the right thing re. aero screen - with that, you really need a helmet, and a helmet means you can't chat to your passenger, or hear the engine as well.

yes, I reached this conclusion too. I think too much time in the car will probably give you hearing damage. i've got an intercom peltor headset which means you can talk to passenger and keep your hearing too.

[edb49]

edb49 said:

Graham E said:

2nd, I hate to say it, but read the book - the lights come on from factory at silly rpm (4.5k as I recall), and do your head in. A few buttons later, and the lights come on 750 rpm below change up point, quickly - much better. You can choose your own settings, obviously.

Thanks for the tip Graham... I did read through the book but couldn't find anything about the shift lights. I'll have another look through as I must have missed it.

Just spent a good half hour trying to find the things about the shift lights in the book, but it's nowhere to be seen. However found out it is this system, and the page explains how to set it up:

http://www.aceserve.co.uk/new04/userguidess.html

Mine came from the factory with 1800rpm as the shift down point, 2500rpm as the first shift light, and 6500rpm as the change up. I've changed it to 6500rpm as first shift light, and 8400rpm change up.