Seven based car
Discussion
Hi
I am considering buying a 7 alike for next summer's motoring (buying in the winter months for cost reasons). My question is whether there is any point paying the premium for a Caterham when I will be using the car for touring/the odd quick blat around the lanes? A Westfield seems to offer similar levels of fun and be more practical for less money. What am I missing?
Thanks
I am considering buying a 7 alike for next summer's motoring (buying in the winter months for cost reasons). My question is whether there is any point paying the premium for a Caterham when I will be using the car for touring/the odd quick blat around the lanes? A Westfield seems to offer similar levels of fun and be more practical for less money. What am I missing?
Thanks
" More practical" ??
how is a westfield more practical than a Caterham? they are both 7-clones with slightly more practicality than a motorcycle, so just test drive a few versions of each with different powerplants and see what you prefer. Also compare styling and how you fit each car (S3, SV, SEI, SEIW) to see what works for you.
how is a westfield more practical than a Caterham? they are both 7-clones with slightly more practicality than a motorcycle, so just test drive a few versions of each with different powerplants and see what you prefer. Also compare styling and how you fit each car (S3, SV, SEI, SEIW) to see what works for you.
Murph: Care to expand at all?
OIn the practicality side - a Westfield comes with a lockable boot and most come with a wide body so you have a little more space to put things. I do, however, appreciate that in practice most storage will be in luggage like that from soft bits for sevens.
OIn the practicality side - a Westfield comes with a lockable boot and most come with a wide body so you have a little more space to put things. I do, however, appreciate that in practice most storage will be in luggage like that from soft bits for sevens.
Nicer looking (unless you go with a pre-lit Westie in which case there's not much in it).
Nicer made (generally - Caterham are hardly paragons though).
Better residuals (perhaps marginal these days, and if such things worry you).
And at the risk of being accused a badge snob, it IS a 7 - direct lineage back to the very first Lotus one. The other's a copy.
If you don't have the budget for a Caterham, a Westfield is a decent alternative. If you do have the budget, my original answer stands.
Nicer made (generally - Caterham are hardly paragons though).
Better residuals (perhaps marginal these days, and if such things worry you).
And at the risk of being accused a badge snob, it IS a 7 - direct lineage back to the very first Lotus one. The other's a copy.
If you don't have the budget for a Caterham, a Westfield is a decent alternative. If you do have the budget, my original answer stands.
I've owned both a Westfield and a Caterham.
The Caterham is cosmetically nicer because it doesn't have acres of wrinkly fibreglass and the trim is so much better.
The Westfield has a well made chassis that is properly powder coated, whereas my Caterham had just a thin lick of black paint on the chassis that was easy to scratch.
Not much in it in terms of ride and handling.
The Caterham is on the small side, whereas a giant can fit in a wide bodied Westie.
I think that the tupperware and powdercoating on the Westie is a better prospect if you wanted to use the car in all weathers.
I am seriously considering another Seven, but it would have to be a Caterham for me.
If I was tempted by any Westfield it would be the XI, which is a delightful, albeit decidedly vintage affair.
The Caterham is cosmetically nicer because it doesn't have acres of wrinkly fibreglass and the trim is so much better.
The Westfield has a well made chassis that is properly powder coated, whereas my Caterham had just a thin lick of black paint on the chassis that was easy to scratch.
Not much in it in terms of ride and handling.
The Caterham is on the small side, whereas a giant can fit in a wide bodied Westie.
I think that the tupperware and powdercoating on the Westie is a better prospect if you wanted to use the car in all weathers.
I am seriously considering another Seven, but it would have to be a Caterham for me.
If I was tempted by any Westfield it would be the XI, which is a delightful, albeit decidedly vintage affair.
I know that the Seven was originally a Lotus product - but there is no doubt that the link between Caterham Cars and Lotus is FAR stronger than any other "Seven" type vehicle producer.
Obviously, in more recent years, Caterham's Sevens have left the original Lotus design behind but right up to the mid 1990s there were significant elements of the Lotus Seven Series III in most Caterhams.
Obviously, in more recent years, Caterham's Sevens have left the original Lotus design behind but right up to the mid 1990s there were significant elements of the Lotus Seven Series III in most Caterhams.
Eric Mc said:
I know that the Seven was originally a Lotus product - but there is no doubt that the link between Caterham Cars and Lotus is FAR stronger than any other "Seven" type vehicle producer.
Obviously, in more recent years, Caterham's Sevens have left the original Lotus design behind but right up to the mid 1990s there were significant elements of the Lotus Seven Series III in most Caterhams.
Obviously, in more recent years, Caterham's Sevens have left the original Lotus design behind but right up to the mid 1990s there were significant elements of the Lotus Seven Series III in most Caterhams.
always gets a response, won't someone think about the heritage! dino ferrana said:
Have you seen Evo magazine track car of the year? Roadsport 125 and R400 thrash latest MX5 based Westfield on road and track scores.
Not exactly a surprise though is it... Brand new cars with all new modern parts trash a kit car made from a 100,000 mile doner vehicle (engine, transmission, diff, brakes, hubs, uprights, steering rack, etc, etc) all of which is a 15+ year old design costing a fraction of the price.
err, they bloody should be better!
Peter T said:
Caterhams have much better resale value.
...and cost twice as much in the first place. Not everyone can justify £20k+ on a toy regardless of how much you might get back.
Edited by juansolo on Monday 30th April 16:55
Sorry didn't realise that the Westfield was using a kebab donor? ;-)
R400 comparison would be somewhat unfair because it is so much more expensive. However I doubt anything other than a very ropey MX5 donor could be build for something less than three quarters of the Roadsports price.
Heritage breeds residual values that make others look decidedly sick and the ability to finance the cars. Say what you like but the Seven is much better looking than the copies because they have all had to alter their designs to avoid legal action. I love the way people come on and defend the copies and their right to exist despite the fact that most are just trading off the 7 name and marketing rather than doing their own.
Long live companies like Ariel, GTM and Ultima who plow their own furrow and don't try to trade on somebody else's name. I see that these days there are an increasing number of Ariel alikes coming to the market, I hope they manage to protect their IP and copyrights too.
R400 comparison would be somewhat unfair because it is so much more expensive. However I doubt anything other than a very ropey MX5 donor could be build for something less than three quarters of the Roadsports price.
Heritage breeds residual values that make others look decidedly sick and the ability to finance the cars. Say what you like but the Seven is much better looking than the copies because they have all had to alter their designs to avoid legal action. I love the way people come on and defend the copies and their right to exist despite the fact that most are just trading off the 7 name and marketing rather than doing their own.
Long live companies like Ariel, GTM and Ultima who plow their own furrow and don't try to trade on somebody else's name. I see that these days there are an increasing number of Ariel alikes coming to the market, I hope they manage to protect their IP and copyrights too.
Thanks for all the comments. I think I will probably pick up an alternative as I will have around £5k to spend at some point over the next 12 months. For that I should be able to get a pre-depreciated Westfield which will outperform the equivalent Caterham (I hope). Plus as it is pre-depreciated I will hopefully not lose money relative to the Caterham option.
juansolo - I hope you don't just post to elicit responses? That would be rather childissh.
However, my comment is based on my true feelings about Sevens and the Lotus/Caterham connections - which are real and fundamental to the car. Indeed, Graham Nearn and Caterham Cars kept the Seven in production at Lotus by continually badgering Colin Chapman to keep it going, even though Chapman had wanted to end production as early as 1966.
If that had happened, the Seven would have faded away like so many 1950s "specials" and would have been forotten by the 80s. By keeping the car alive and current, Caterham ensured that other manufacturers were eventually able to "tap into" the small market for these unique types of vehicles.
I have great respect for all Seven inspired cars, Caterham or otherwise. I am glad they exist and I would never turn my nose at any of them - especially Westfield, who have (after a brief battle with Caterham Cars) found their own corner of the market and done some very clever things with their concepts. I think their new Eleven idea is fantastic - which shows that they keep at least half an eye on the Lotus "heritage" thing too.
However, my comment is based on my true feelings about Sevens and the Lotus/Caterham connections - which are real and fundamental to the car. Indeed, Graham Nearn and Caterham Cars kept the Seven in production at Lotus by continually badgering Colin Chapman to keep it going, even though Chapman had wanted to end production as early as 1966.
If that had happened, the Seven would have faded away like so many 1950s "specials" and would have been forotten by the 80s. By keeping the car alive and current, Caterham ensured that other manufacturers were eventually able to "tap into" the small market for these unique types of vehicles.
I have great respect for all Seven inspired cars, Caterham or otherwise. I am glad they exist and I would never turn my nose at any of them - especially Westfield, who have (after a brief battle with Caterham Cars) found their own corner of the market and done some very clever things with their concepts. I think their new Eleven idea is fantastic - which shows that they keep at least half an eye on the Lotus "heritage" thing too.
Eric Mc said:
juansolo - I hope you don't just post to elicit responses? That would be rather childissh.
No, not at all. Honestly you guys are too touchy some times (I surrounded the comments in smilies to show their intent as humour/tongue in cheek). I've been driving Caterhams now for around 7 years and owning Westfields for the same amount of time. I have extremely balanced views on both cars seeing as I use both on a very regular basis. As cars I love both, I'm allowed to do that. The badge snobs that look down on 'lesser copies' of the Caterham amuse me. To some people it's almost a religion with Chapman held as some kind of messiah. It seems their mission to berate these other cars and their owners for being stupid enough not to buy 'the real thing', any argument to this must be jealousy. Honestly, if you could see what this reads like to people who want a Caterfield and really don't give a bugger what went on 40 years ago, but want a track/road toy, you'd cringe.
I could wax on for ages about the history of the cars but, honestly there is no point, it's been done to death on Blatchat. The blinkered simply believe that Caterham=Lotus=Chapman and all else is to be pitied. Having a rational debate with these people is akin to smacking your head repeatedly against a brick wall (not you by the way, but there are a couple on this thread). Life's too short to be honest with you. I can enjoy the cars on their merits and am too tired to get caught up in an internet crusade.
Edited by juansolo on Tuesday 1st May 06:57
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