C5 Erratic Fuel Gauge Problem
Discussion
There have been many, many, many reports of fuel gauge problems in the C5. They show up in a lot of C5s built from 1997 to 2002. The problems usually show up when it is less than half full, either the fuel gauge makes a dive for the empty mark when there are still 3-4 gallons left or it sticks at a quarter full even when there is nothing left !
GM made a number of attempts to fix it. In cars built before 2001 the answer seems to be to replace the fuel tank senders on both the right and left tanks. This didn't work for everyone though.
The next solution GM came up with was to recalibrate the fuel system via software which again solved some but not everybody's problems.
I have not heard of any fuel gauge issues from the 2003 models onwards so maybe they've finally resolved the issue.
If your car is under warranty then I'd recommend going to an official dealer and getting it sorted out that way. If not then there are a couple of other options.
I had the problem show up when my 2002 C5 was 14,000 miles old and at first the gauge dived to zero, then it stayed above halfway for too long. I tried putting in a good dose of fuel system cleaner and that removed the problem. At the time I suggested that putting a dose of cleaner in every 10,000 miles would be a good piece of precautionary maintenance. Well, of course I didn't follow my own advice and 11,500 miles later I had exactly the same problem ! I used the fuel system cleaner again and the problem has gone away again.
The final option is one that will be second nature to any motorcyclist - reset your trip meter whenever you fill up. I get 26 MPG on average and know that I can safely get 300 miles out of a full tank. I'm happy doing 360-380 miles when driving gently. Check the trip meter occasionally and refill once you get past your comfort mark.
From my experience an extra indicator that will show when you are down below 9 litres remaining in the tank is when the engine cuts during high-G right hand corners !
GM made a number of attempts to fix it. In cars built before 2001 the answer seems to be to replace the fuel tank senders on both the right and left tanks. This didn't work for everyone though.
The next solution GM came up with was to recalibrate the fuel system via software which again solved some but not everybody's problems.
I have not heard of any fuel gauge issues from the 2003 models onwards so maybe they've finally resolved the issue.
If your car is under warranty then I'd recommend going to an official dealer and getting it sorted out that way. If not then there are a couple of other options.
I had the problem show up when my 2002 C5 was 14,000 miles old and at first the gauge dived to zero, then it stayed above halfway for too long. I tried putting in a good dose of fuel system cleaner and that removed the problem. At the time I suggested that putting a dose of cleaner in every 10,000 miles would be a good piece of precautionary maintenance. Well, of course I didn't follow my own advice and 11,500 miles later I had exactly the same problem ! I used the fuel system cleaner again and the problem has gone away again.
The final option is one that will be second nature to any motorcyclist - reset your trip meter whenever you fill up. I get 26 MPG on average and know that I can safely get 300 miles out of a full tank. I'm happy doing 360-380 miles when driving gently. Check the trip meter occasionally and refill once you get past your comfort mark.
From my experience an extra indicator that will show when you are down below 9 litres remaining in the tank is when the engine cuts during high-G right hand corners !
Guys, thanks for the above - an annoying and potentially highly embarrassing problem, but one which I can easily live with until someone comes up with a proper fix (the "trip" method works for me) - you can go on for ever trying to isolate these intermittent problems. This is even worse for me with Frosts being 70 miles away.
See you Sunday?? (Here's hoping none of us run out of petrol!!! Ha)
See you Sunday?? (Here's hoping none of us run out of petrol!!! Ha)
I think mine gave the erratic fuel gauge yesterday.
I had done about 200 miles to and it read 1/2 tank.
Stopped for about 1/2 day and started later that evening and was down to 3/8ths, but as I drove along it started to rise back up and then came back to over 1/2 tank in about 10 minutes!
I carried on and was driving on the motorway at 70 for about 20 odd miles and a bit of back lane for 6 miles to home, all the time it was dropping quite drastically. Got home and it was touching 1/4. I'd even turned the ac off!!
Total miles on the tank 225 so far. 1/4 left indicated!
Is this something I can get checked under warranty?
Will try the fuel cleaner as T says in the meantime.....
I had done about 200 miles to and it read 1/2 tank.
Stopped for about 1/2 day and started later that evening and was down to 3/8ths, but as I drove along it started to rise back up and then came back to over 1/2 tank in about 10 minutes!
I carried on and was driving on the motorway at 70 for about 20 odd miles and a bit of back lane for 6 miles to home, all the time it was dropping quite drastically. Got home and it was touching 1/4. I'd even turned the ac off!!
Total miles on the tank 225 so far. 1/4 left indicated!
Is this something I can get checked under warranty?
Will try the fuel cleaner as T says in the meantime.....
Mark, Frosts of Shoreham had a look at my 2001 under warranty and undertook some sort of factory fix by fiddling with the voltage to the fuel senders (they had a GM bulletin on the subject). Nothing was replaced and as I always fill up around the 200 mile mark I never put their fix to the test.
They were also dealing with another 2001 at the same time but he was told to monitor his problem. I would speak to Bauers first and then Frosts if you need more information.
They were also dealing with another 2001 at the same time but he was told to monitor his problem. I would speak to Bauers first and then Frosts if you need more information.
Okay, I haven't researched this, but I thought the problem was denied by GM on the basis that they didn't consider it to be their fault. I'm sure you can do a web search, but I seem to remember something along the lines of the material they used for the fuel sensor was eaten by additives in some but not all fuels... basically GM simply recommended that you didn't use these brands of fuel...
-kenski
-kenski
kenski said:
basically GM simply recommended that you didn't use these brands of fuel...
-kenski
Interesting.... since the pumps don't give a list of ingredients so to see if your car is allergic to any of them. Not sure if i can differentiate between Supermarket or Oil Co gasoline.
>> Edited by gsmcoverage on Tuesday 8th June 16:33
kenski said:
basically GM simply recommended that you didn't use these brands of fuel...
-kenski
...but since the oil companies indulge in swap arrangements the fuel you get is most likely to come from the owner of your nearest refinery rather than the brand owner of the petrol station. Having said that I have noticed the problem is more likely to occur after I have filled up at an Esso station than anywhere else.
You could try scrolling down through this thread
www.z06vette.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=50436
Makes mention of sulphur (sulfur) levels in the fuel causing problems, and suggesting additives to counteract the effect. Disclaimer - may or may not be correct.
-kenski
www.z06vette.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=50436
Makes mention of sulphur (sulfur) levels in the fuel causing problems, and suggesting additives to counteract the effect. Disclaimer - may or may not be correct.
-kenski
kenski said:
You could try scrolling down through this thread
www.z06vette.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=50436
-kenski
I suffered this at around 29K. On the 30K service Frosts did something like short the circuit for the senders. After that it worked fine for a month or so, then reappeared. The at 35k, ie last year, it disappered all by itself never to reappear. I normally use the same petrol station and ALWAYS use normal unleaded, not Super. Interestingly Frosts reflashed my PCM recently on the 40K service to try and cure a slow opening boot. So might be worth asking for that next time a garage is visited.
It was an American one that I got through Demon Tweeks. Redline Fuel System cleaner (not just injectors but the whole system). I tried the Redex equivalent recently and had a recurrence of the gauge problem a short while after.
As GM do seem to have fixed the issue now after a number of attempts I am seriously considering making a warranty claim and getting it fixed the official way.
As GM do seem to have fixed the issue now after a number of attempts I am seriously considering making a warranty claim and getting it fixed the official way.
te51cle said:
...
As GM do seem to have fixed the issue now after a number of attempts I am seriously considering making a warranty claim and getting it fixed the official way.
Having boasted that mine disappeared at 35K, well it came back again at 44K, ie yesterday! I was following a yellow convertible at the time but I don't suppose he will admit liability. With warranty running out on 28th June I need to act on this. In your original post you said the sender replacement worked for some and the software fix worked for some. In you last post you say "GM do seem.." What was the final fix that sorted it? I would like to ensure Frosts are aware.
GM had a number of different tries at fixing the fuel gauge problem. Changing the sender in the right hand tank, changing the sender in the left hand tank, changing both senders in both tanks, updating the computer to interpret the fuel levels differently (aka flashing the PCM), updating the computer and changing the senders...
A competent GM garage can find the latest software updates for a vehicle here http://calid.gm.com/vci/VINEntryPre.do
It seems like there's quite a few for my car, my ABS is a bit aggressive at times so I think I'll ask for that to be done too ! I think a lot depends on when your car was built as to which remedy should be applied. Reflashing the PCM so that it uses different voltages to interpret sender information is the first solution, replacing the senders is a long job and probably only one that you and any garage would only want to do if absolutely necessary.
Here's some background reading: http://forums.corvetteforum.com/zerothread?id=776800&postid=1546771552#1546771552
A competent GM garage can find the latest software updates for a vehicle here http://calid.gm.com/vci/VINEntryPre.do
It seems like there's quite a few for my car, my ABS is a bit aggressive at times so I think I'll ask for that to be done too ! I think a lot depends on when your car was built as to which remedy should be applied. Reflashing the PCM so that it uses different voltages to interpret sender information is the first solution, replacing the senders is a long job and probably only one that you and any garage would only want to do if absolutely necessary.
Here's some background reading: http://forums.corvetteforum.com/zerothread?id=776800&postid=1546771552#1546771552
Here's a Technical Service Bulletin number to quote to your favourite garage:
Erratic Fuel Gauge Reading (Reprogram the PCM) #02-06-04-010A - (06/27/2003) 1999-2002 Chevrolet Corvette
This bulletin is being revised to add models and update the Correction and Warranty Information. Please discard Corporate Bulletin Number 02-06-04-010 (Section 06- Engine).
Condition
Some owners may comment about the fuel gauge intermittently indicating an empty reading and then return to the correct fuel level indication.
Cause
This condition may result when fuel blends containing aggressive sulphur compounds react with the fuel sender assembly, which may result in voltage spikes being induced on the fuel level signal to the PCM. Use of another fuel blend may reverse this reaction and return the system to normal operation.
Correction
Reprogram the PCM with the new service calibration which is available in the June 2003, Techline® TIS release sent to the dealers on 6/28/03. Use the TIS Version 7 or later data update.
Warranty Information
For vehicles repaired under warranty, use:
Labor Operation
Description
Labor Time
J6354
Powertrain Controller - Reprogram
Use Published Time
Erratic Fuel Gauge Reading (Reprogram the PCM) #02-06-04-010A - (06/27/2003) 1999-2002 Chevrolet Corvette
This bulletin is being revised to add models and update the Correction and Warranty Information. Please discard Corporate Bulletin Number 02-06-04-010 (Section 06- Engine).
Condition
Some owners may comment about the fuel gauge intermittently indicating an empty reading and then return to the correct fuel level indication.
Cause
This condition may result when fuel blends containing aggressive sulphur compounds react with the fuel sender assembly, which may result in voltage spikes being induced on the fuel level signal to the PCM. Use of another fuel blend may reverse this reaction and return the system to normal operation.
Correction
Reprogram the PCM with the new service calibration which is available in the June 2003, Techline® TIS release sent to the dealers on 6/28/03. Use the TIS Version 7 or later data update.
Warranty Information
For vehicles repaired under warranty, use:
Labor Operation
Description
Labor Time
J6354
Powertrain Controller - Reprogram
Use Published Time
So a nice PCM Code today just happily driving along! Tank was just below half and wham LOW FUEL and P1431 appeared "Fuel Level Sensor 2 Circuit Performance"
Tried cycling the car but it remained down.... It needs to go to BM for a check for the column lock recall, so i can get them to take a look. I
n the meantime does the problem go away by itself or now its on will it stay up forever? I havent tried to re-fill it yet, so that could be the first step and maybe some cleaner.
Tried cycling the car but it remained down.... It needs to go to BM for a check for the column lock recall, so i can get them to take a look. I
n the meantime does the problem go away by itself or now its on will it stay up forever? I havent tried to re-fill it yet, so that could be the first step and maybe some cleaner.
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