Veyron 253mph vs Corvette 254mph....

[malc350]

Okay this is probably old news as last night's Top Gear was a repeat on the Dave channel.

Let's get this part over with: It was pretty exciting watching James May taking the Veyron up to its advertised top speed of 407 Km/h or 253 mph and I was as glued to the TV set as I've ever been.

However, the preamble, exciting as it may seem to some, almost put me into a coma (probably James May's monotones as much as the build-up...)

Anyway what I listed to was: 4 turbochargers, 1001 BHP, 10 radiators, spoiler retracting and car lowering for "top speed mode", special materials used in car's construction, and all the other ridiculous rhubarb, not least of all the near 900k price (I thought it was a round million?)

So here's what's getting my goat: as a previous Callaway Twin Turbo Corvette owner I feel almost religiously obliged to remind Corvette owners and the world alike about the Callaway SledgeHammer.

And in words copied from Wikipedia I'll just copy and paste their words as they are more eloquent that my good self about the matter:

________________________________________________

After the Car and Driver test event, which Callaway drove a specially modified Callaway Twin Turbo Corvette (C4), known as the "Top Gun" project to the best of 231 mph (372 km/h), winning the test run. A production Callaway managed a best of, 187.95 mph (302.48 km/h).[7]

As Callaway wanted to take the record further into 250 mph (402 km/h) with the car being docile during traffic, he developed the SledgeHammer Corvette, to allow airflow into the engine, he commissioned Paul Deutschman of Deutschman Design to develop the Callaway Aerobody for stability.[8] The engine was extensively hand built with its turbo intercoolers being relocated from either side of the intake manifold to the front, behind the bumper. Overall engine power was rated at 898 horsepower @ 6200 rpm with 772 lb·ft (1,047 N·m) of torque @ 5250 rpm.[7] The car retained its road car amenities such as power windows and locks, Bose radio, electronic air conditioning and, power sport seats with all necessary race car modifications such as roll cage.[7]

Driven by John Lingenfelter, the car reached 254.76 mph (410 km/h) mph at the Transportation Research Center, Ohio and was driven back to Old Lyme.[7]

The Aerobody would become commercially available this would become the first of the partnerships with Deutschman, in which he also designed its later models such as Speedster, SuperNatural, C7, C12 and C16.[8]


[edit] Performance Stats
Horsepower: 898 bhp / 669.6 kW @6200 rpm
Torque: 772.2 ft·lbf / 1047.0 Nm @6200 rpm
BHP/Liter: 157.54 bhp/Liter
Power to weight ratio: 0.565 bhp/kg
Top Speed: 254.8 mph / 409.9 km/h
0 - 60 mph acceleration: 3.9 seconds
1/4 Mile: 10.6 seconds

__________________________________________________

I feel much better now! Malc

Edited by malc350 on Thursday 11th September 12:33

[G4HKS]

And so indeed you should Malc.

Quite how anybody can sit through the crap that May & Co. dish out each episode is beyond me.

[LuS1fer]

But the Veyron is a production car. It might be different if the Sledgehammer was used to pop down to Walmart or used as a daily driver but it wasn't, it was simply a missile for achieving the record. I'd take the Veyron. Must be down to £35k by now...

[malc350]

LuS1fer said:

But the Veyron is a production car. It might be different if the Sledgehammer was used to pop down to Walmart or used as a daily driver but it wasn't, it was simply a missile for achieving the record. I'd take the Veyron. Must be down to £35k by now...

Actually I realised that at the time of posting and it's a shame Callaway never really developed the car becuase no doubt with a year or two of development the car could have had some bugs ironed out.

I have road tests of Callaways from the late 80s where all they did was blow up, catch fire, break down or whatever (didn't stop me buying one though!) The impression they gave was of a lack of development time and / or money.

Mind you, if there was a production "Super Corvette" on a par with a Veyron, programmes like Top Gear would probably not acknowledge its existence...

[LuS1fer]

malc350 said:

LuS1fer said:

But the Veyron is a production car. It might be different if the Sledgehammer was used to pop down to Walmart or used as a daily driver but it wasn't, it was simply a missile for achieving the record. I'd take the Veyron. Must be down to £35k by now...

Actually I realised that at the time of posting and it's a shame Callaway never really developed the car becuase no doubt with a year or two of development the car could have had some bugs ironed out.

I have road tests of Callaways from the late 80s where all they did was blow up, catch fire, break down or whatever (didn't stop me buying one though!) The impression they gave was of a lack of development time and / or money.

Mind you, if there was a production "Super Corvette" on a par with a Veyron, programmes like Top Gear would probably not acknowledge its existence...

I think the new ZR1 is close.

I was very tempted by a 1986 Callaway Twin Turbo back in the day but in retrospect, I'm glad I didn't.

[malc350]

LuS1fer said:

I think the new ZR1 is close.

I was very tempted by a 1986 Callaway Twin Turbo back in the day but in retrospect, I'm glad I didn't.

I can't agree that the new ZR1 is in a league even approaching the Veyron, not least of all because of its 51mph deficit in ultimate velocity: And, much as I'm a 'vette fan, class-wise it's a bit like Lilly Allen compared to Eva Longoria...

Anyone who knows me will tell you how obsessed I am with landing my hands on a C6 Z06 as soon as I can humanly afford one (glad to say the prices seem to be diving faster than Gar y Glit r's record sales) but the new ZR1 is a bit too much like it's driven through Halfords covered in superglue and come out covered in bodykits to my taste...

However the Callaway was a good buy, you should've given it a go. I didn't really have any real problems, just a clutch, a busted oil hose, a leaky intake gasket (drove me mad replacing it) and routine servicing in 3 years and over 20,000 miles...

Bargain but I couldn't get rid of it over here due to a complete lack of understanding what the car was...

Took a crazy guy from Finland to actually have the b s to buy it. And he got a real bargain.

You reading this Ari???!!!

Edited by malc350 on Thursday 11th September 14:46

[G4HKS]

Eva who?

[malc350]

G4HKS said:

Eva who?

http://images.google.co.uk/images?rlz=1W1SNYW&...

If you haven't heard of her you may possibly be recruited by the Village People....

Edited by malc350 on Thursday 11th September 15:14

[roscobbc]

LuS1fer said:

malc350 said:

LuS1fer said:

But the Veyron is a production car. It might be different if the Sledgehammer was used to pop down to Walmart or used as a daily driver but it wasn't, it was simply a missile for achieving the record. I'd take the Veyron. Must be down to £35k by now...

Actually I realised that at the time of posting and it's a shame Callaway never really developed the car becuase no doubt with a year or two of development the car could have had some bugs ironed out.

I have road tests of Callaways from the late 80s where all they did was blow up, catch fire, break down or whatever (didn't stop me buying one though!) The impression they gave was of a lack of development time and / or money.

Mind you, if there was a production "Super Corvette" on a par with a Veyron, programmes like Top Gear would probably not acknowledge its existence...

I think the new ZR1 is close.

I was very tempted by a 1986 Callaway Twin Turbo back in the day but in retrospect, I'm glad I didn't.

It almost seemed that as soon as Callaway bought something quick out, there was good old GM with something fully productionised just as quick, and easily and safely purchased though a GM dealer, e.g. ZR1. Having said that Callaways were available through GM dealers with a specific part no. Perhaps it was a price related thing at double the cost of a stock 'Vette. In todays terms would buyers purchase a GM warranted $100000 'new' ZR1 or the latest Callaway product? BTW Malcolm, George still has and uses his '87 Callaway.

[FinnCallaway]

malc350 said:

Took a crazy guy from Finland to actually have the b s to buy it. And he got a real bargain.
You reading this Ari???!!!

Yeah, I`m here Malc... :-)

Edited by FinnCallaway on Tuesday 16th September 22:43

[Godzilla]

roscobbc said:

LuS1fer said:

malc350 said:

LuS1fer said:

But the Veyron is a production car. It might be different if the Sledgehammer was used to pop down to Walmart or used as a daily driver but it wasn't, it was simply a missile for achieving the record. I'd take the Veyron. Must be down to £35k by now...

Actually I realised that at the time of posting and it's a shame Callaway never really developed the car becuase no doubt with a year or two of development the car could have had some bugs ironed out.

I have road tests of Callaways from the late 80s where all they did was blow up, catch fire, break down or whatever (didn't stop me buying one though!) The impression they gave was of a lack of development time and / or money.

Mind you, if there was a production "Super Corvette" on a par with a Veyron, programmes like Top Gear would probably not acknowledge its existence...

I think the new ZR1 is close.

I was very tempted by a 1986 Callaway Twin Turbo back in the day but in retrospect, I'm glad I didn't.

It almost seemed that as soon as Callaway bought something quick out, there was good old GM with something fully productionised just as quick, and easily and safely purchased though a GM dealer, e.g. ZR1. Having said that Callaways were available through GM dealers with a specific part no. Perhaps it was a price related thing at double the cost of a stock 'Vette. In todays terms would buyers purchase a GM warranted $100000 'new' ZR1 or the latest Callaway product? BTW Malcolm, George still has and uses his '87 Callaway.

According to the GM guy at Le Mans who brought a Callaway supercharged C6 along, the Callaway conversions ARE still covered under GM's warranty. Can anyone confirm that?

However, looking at the prices, I would take a ZR1 every time.

[LuS1fer]

Godzilla said:

However, looking at the prices, I would take a ZR1 every time.

Assuming you could get one out of the filthy profiteering hands of a US dealer you mean.

[JenkinsComp]

Callaway Conversions can be ordered from the dealer when placing an order for a Corvette.
The car gets shipped from the factory to Callaway, who carry out the conversion before delivering the car to your dealer.
As such they are covered by warranty.

[franv8]

LuS1fer said:

But the Veyron is a production car. It might be different if the Sledgehammer was used to pop down to Walmart or used as a daily driver but it wasn't, it was simply a missile for achieving the record. I'd take the Veyron. Must be down to £35k by now...

I was thinking about this today. In one respect, I think the Veyron is a complete failure (okay - this is going to lead to a discussion) - the amount it cost to develop, how many people and man hours went into the job, and VW's reputed (huge) loss on every one sold. Basically, to sum up, it was only the sheer might of VW and the danger to them publically losing face over it (and they were as deadlines slipped and slipped), that saw this car reach daylight as a 'production' car.

The Sledgehammer was a vision of Callaways, and I think fair to say perhaps more of a test mule to see what happened at the outer limits of turbocharging, and aerodynamics. Perhaps makes it an unfair comparison between the two, I think the Sledgehammer was more of a heroic car, the Veyron maybe a mere example of how far you can go with it if you throw oodles of cash at a job. And it still only achieved the similar top speeds. Maybe better to talk about where the Mclaren F1 fits in here too - I think it's probably more of an honest engineering job the the Veyron, and at the time really pushed the limit. The Veyron now occupies a shared space with Koenigseggs, and I guess 'tuner' 911's too

As for the real old Callaway C4's, if GM just productionised performance in the shape of the ZR1, I think they were at least three years behind, and with a car that enjoyed a smaller production span (in years)? (Not sure about that, but they were not dissimilar), one was GM led, the otehr from some tuning guy in Connecticut.

Malc - your inlet manifold gasket was not Callaway specific, it seems to be a 'feature' of the L98 engine!!