Z06 cans new Lotus Esprit
Discussion
As a former Esprit owner I've been following the progress towards a new Esprit which was due in 2008. Lotus have recently announced the postponement (more likely cancellation) of that car. I'm sure one of the main reasons is that Z06 has shifted the price/performance benchmark in a big way with 500 bhp and a much improved chassis at just (!) £65,000. No way in my opinion can any small manufacturer begin to compete with Z06 performance at the engineering quality and overall reliability that's needed to sell cars. Well done the General!
We'll soon see how Saturn Sky fares as well. Looks a fine car to me. Its Pontiac Solstice relation seems to be selling well in USA but from what I've seen of Solstice it's a bit "lardy" for European tastes. Saturn Sky has a lighter character.
We'll soon see how Saturn Sky fares as well. Looks a fine car to me. Its Pontiac Solstice relation seems to be selling well in USA but from what I've seen of Solstice it's a bit "lardy" for European tastes. Saturn Sky has a lighter character.
Well I'm not too sure congratulations are in order!
1) I'm not convinced that it was the Z06 that caused the postponement. More likely newcomers like Noble, or simply lack of money to develop the car.
2) I'd like to see Lotus do well. The countless Elise derivatives around are ageing badly and a new Esprit is essential to their continued survival IMO.
1) I'm not convinced that it was the Z06 that caused the postponement. More likely newcomers like Noble, or simply lack of money to develop the car.
2) I'd like to see Lotus do well. The countless Elise derivatives around are ageing badly and a new Esprit is essential to their continued survival IMO.
Yes, it would be great to see Lotus do well but sadly if the best idea they've got for the next car is a "Proton 2+2" mentioned in the same announcement I think they're in trouble!
Nearly mentioned Noble in my post as they've grabbed the UK specialist mid-engined slice of the market. I think the biggest problem now is that the Western "big boys" are all in the up-market sports car niche markets globally and there's nowhere for Lotus to get a foothold.
GM - Corvette/XLR
Fiat - Ferrari
Audi - Lambo
Porsche - bigger and bigger
Ford - new GT and Astons
The newly established US dealer network must be tearing their hair out with essentially a one model range. They have the Exige at a huge price but it's an even closer Elise relation than the UK version. Even the Elise costs nearly the same a base C6.
The beauty of Z06 is that although unbelievers whinge about the interior and other superficial issues there's a simply astounding performance car underneath at a relatively reasonable price.
Nearly mentioned Noble in my post as they've grabbed the UK specialist mid-engined slice of the market. I think the biggest problem now is that the Western "big boys" are all in the up-market sports car niche markets globally and there's nowhere for Lotus to get a foothold.
GM - Corvette/XLR
Fiat - Ferrari
Audi - Lambo
Porsche - bigger and bigger
Ford - new GT and Astons
The newly established US dealer network must be tearing their hair out with essentially a one model range. They have the Exige at a huge price but it's an even closer Elise relation than the UK version. Even the Elise costs nearly the same a base C6.
The beauty of Z06 is that although unbelievers whinge about the interior and other superficial issues there's a simply astounding performance car underneath at a relatively reasonable price.
Yes...I'm sure it was the Corvette that was the sole reason for postponing the next Lotus.
No doubt the new Z06 is awesome but there are plenty out there who don't want to buy one and would gladly spend double that money another brand of car, even if it has less power.
By your reasoning Porsche wouldn't be selling any new 911's, the Aston V8 would have been cancelled and Gallordos would have been history...a little OTT me thinks.
No doubt the new Z06 is awesome but there are plenty out there who don't want to buy one and would gladly spend double that money another brand of car, even if it has less power.
By your reasoning Porsche wouldn't be selling any new 911's, the Aston V8 would have been cancelled and Gallordos would have been history...a little OTT me thinks.
************
The beauty of Z06 is that although unbelievers whinge about the interior and other superficial issues there's a simply astounding performance car underneath at a relatively reasonable price.
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Hi, Fortunately I was able to drive the c6 with automatic gear-box and the Z06 in Germany ,
and I know that especially German magazines tend to critizise the interior resp. the so-called a bit bulky gear - box, so WHAT, if the car has no so-called image, that is the reason for me to buy in around 1-2 years a really well prepared Vette and give a dammn on the journalists who are "driving" all their test-cars without respect for people who just like
one brand or the other. What is the problem, if you can drive around a corner 1 or 3 miles faster, I am looking a the all-round qualities :-) That said, I like my actual car, but I am not so sure about the new
shape coming out in 2008 ;-)
BTW, I was very impressed by the normal Vette 6, even if the brakes look like from a Golf or BMW, they are up to their task, the all-round behaviour is excellent. The Z06 seems to be brutish, but it all depends on YOURSELF, how your are handling it. I loved it, but I love to have an open roof above my head,too, if weather permits.
Enjoy your cars :-)))...and here the Vette is much cheaper than in the UK...
Rainer-Switzerland
The beauty of Z06 is that although unbelievers whinge about the interior and other superficial issues there's a simply astounding performance car underneath at a relatively reasonable price.
*************
Hi, Fortunately I was able to drive the c6 with automatic gear-box and the Z06 in Germany ,
and I know that especially German magazines tend to critizise the interior resp. the so-called a bit bulky gear - box, so WHAT, if the car has no so-called image, that is the reason for me to buy in around 1-2 years a really well prepared Vette and give a dammn on the journalists who are "driving" all their test-cars without respect for people who just like
one brand or the other. What is the problem, if you can drive around a corner 1 or 3 miles faster, I am looking a the all-round qualities :-) That said, I like my actual car, but I am not so sure about the new
shape coming out in 2008 ;-)
BTW, I was very impressed by the normal Vette 6, even if the brakes look like from a Golf or BMW, they are up to their task, the all-round behaviour is excellent. The Z06 seems to be brutish, but it all depends on YOURSELF, how your are handling it. I loved it, but I love to have an open roof above my head,too, if weather permits.
Enjoy your cars :-)))...and here the Vette is much cheaper than in the UK...
Rainer-Switzerland
yellowshark454 said:
Blimey, I thought everything in Switzerland was more expensive!. How many Euros is a C6Z?
I think I'm correct in saying that Swiss VAT is under 8% so that saves the best part of £5k on a £50k car, except that you still have to pay UK VAT if you import it. If you want to buy one in Switzerland you'll need a price in Swiss Francs, not euros.
A base coupe auto is 83,000 swiss franc plus tax. Z06 is over 100k.
Edited by c5ragtop on Thursday 21st September 22:22
Back on topic...
Can I have a pint of whatever he's on?!
5 USA said:
As a former Esprit owner I've been following the progress towards a new Esprit which was due in 2008. Lotus have recently announced the postponement (more likely cancellation) of that car. I'm sure one of the main reasons is that Z06 has shifted the price/performance benchmark in a big way with 500 bhp and a much improved chassis at just (!) £65,000. No way in my opinion can any small manufacturer begin to compete with Z06 performance at the engineering quality and overall reliability that's needed to sell cars. Well done the General!
Can I have a pint of whatever he's on?!
Hi , here are some price infos incl. Swiss VAT of 7,6%:
Z06: incl. Luxury-Pack: CHF 110,850.--
c6 Coupe Targa, manual,base CHF 84,425.--
dito.,Z-51 pack incl.,autom. CHF 89,275.--
Cabrio,manual,incl.Luxpack CHF 98,300.--
Cabrio,auto,incl.Luxpack&Z51 CHF 103,725.--
Luxpack, CHF 5450.-- for coupe only
Satnav CHF 4450.--
magn.ride CHF 2950.-- for coupe and cabrio
polished rims CHF 2450.-- for all types
transparent
plexi roof CHF 1250.-- instead of body-colour
metallic col. CHF 1050.-- LMBlue,Silver,Daytona Sunset Orange
tint-coat col. CHF 1250.-- Veloc.yellow,Monterey red
cars as per Euro-specs :-)
as quoted by
www.us-carconnection.ch, great chaps there....
price-base: gross, net: ????
I hope this gives you an idea, 2nd hand cars or demonstrators are rather good value overhere.
Have nice, sunny week-end
Rainer-CH
owenemyr said:
Dont wish to be a Job's comforter, but if you import a car from a non EEC country, you will have to pay a total of 27.5% on the purchase and shipping price (including Switzerland)This is 10% importation tax, and 17.5% vat on top.
No it's worse than that. You take the purchase price and add 10% then add 17.5% to the new total (including shipping if there is any). That is more like 29.25%!
And 5 USA, I don't know if you're being serious or not, but there is absolutely NO correlation between the Z06 and TVR's demise...
godzilla said:
there is absolutely NO correlation between the Z06 and TVR's demise...
That's an interesting opinion, but what are the facts?
Back in 1990 the big car companies weren't into sports cars and the "specialist British manufacturers" had a market niche for their cars. These days the mainstream market is dominated by Aston V8, BMW Z4, Cayman, S2000, Corvette and other excellent product from the major manufacturers. Of those cars I see the C5/C6 as the greatest threat to companies like Lotus and TVR. Certainly when I bought my Vette those were the alternatives to consider. IMO every Corvette purchased in UK is a direct substitute for a TVR/Noble/Lotus/Marcos.
5 USA said:
godzilla said:
there is absolutely NO correlation between the Z06 and TVR's demise...
That's an interesting opinion, but what are the facts?
Back in 1990 the big car companies weren't into sports cars and the "specialist British manufacturers" had a market niche for their cars. These days the mainstream market is dominated by Aston V8, BMW Z4, Cayman, S2000, Corvette and other excellent product from the major manufacturers. Of those cars I see the C5/C6 as the greatest threat to companies like Lotus and TVR. Certainly when I bought my Vette those were the alternatives to consider. IMO every Corvette purchased in UK is a direct substitute for a TVR/Noble/Lotus/Marcos.
There are about a dozen Z06s in the UK so they cannot be responsible for TVR's "demise" (which BTW hasn't happened - manufacturing's moving, not ending).
5 USA said:
Certainly when I bought my Vette those were the alternatives to consider. IMO every Corvette purchased in UK is a direct substitute for a TVR/Noble/Lotus/Marcos.
Not everyone thinks like you....
How many ZO6's on the road in UK? How many Corvettes in general are on the road in UK vs TVR, Noble, Lotus, Marcos, 911, astons etc etc?? I live in london and see every sort of sports car on the road daily. I have yet to see the new z06 but I can't begin to tell you how many of the others I have seen.
Like I said before the z06 is a fantastic car but to say it was a major reason for the Esprit demise/delay and now TVR moving complete nonsense.
You have nice car-nobody denys that so stop trying to big it up.
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