Off-duty Police in Kent

[benjr]

Ok I know that This really belongs in the Plod and the Law bit, but as a new member I can't post there... and I would like some thoughts on this...

Also at no point am I saying what I did wasn't wrong...

When driving home last night I was being tailgated by a BMW with personalised plates, This went on for a good few minutes before I was hacked off enough to brake test him once the road around me was clear (he was not being followed)... I hit the breaks maybe a little harder than I should causing him to have to swerve not to hit me. Thinking that would cause him to back off off I went.

Now at the traffic lights I see he's getting out to come over and talk to me, obviously not happy. Before he arrives I try to say sorry that I tested him to that degree, before I finish he shoves a black leather wallet in my face with a metal badge in (assuming off-duty police though no ID included) saying "what the f**c do you think your doing, I've been following you and you have been swerving across the road and driving dangerously. He says that he's got the right mind to hold me and get a breath test done on me, which he does not do, and then says that he has my license plate and might when next on duty come and "pay me a visit".

Now the point of this thread, If he was a off duty police officer, what is he able to do in this situation that could cause me any issues? also when identifying himself should he not of told me his name and station? and if not does that change the situation?

I know it wasn't a smart thing to do but after a long day I was pretty hacked off which isn't a excuse, anyway I'm just asking for a little insight.

[Turboshmick]

OFF DUTY is exactly what he was! He can not do anything other than report the whole incident, but on what evidence does he stand? NONE
I got pulled over by an unmarked corsa years ago when i was driving like an idiot in my bmw, i thought it was a bunch of lads trying to hi-jack me (which has happened before)so i kept speeding off. They followed me near to my house where i got out at a friends, to discover they were police men, they ranted and raved at me i told them to shut up and they had no rights to chase me in an umarked un lighted vehicle like that. They agreed apologised and drove off.

[Defcon5]

Turboshmick said:

i told them to shut up and they had no rights to chase me in an umarked un lighted vehicle like that. They agreed apologised and drove off.

Ill have to remember that next time I get pulled over, just tell them to shut up and they will drive off

[SMGB]

Defcon5 said:

Turboshmick said:

i told them to shut up and they had no rights to chase me in an umarked un lighted vehicle like that. They agreed apologised and drove off.

Ill have to remember that next time I get pulled over, just tell them to shut up and they will drive off

You can ask for a uniformed officer in a marked car to attend and sit tight until then. This is recommended for women travelling alone.
I think this event was a windup, a police officer would not behave like that and would have a warrant card.

[roscobbc]

Many, many years ago when I was perhaps just a little bit rebelious - in my mildly tuned & booted Mini travelling down to the local garage 'hang-out' one evening (Albert Road Garage in Romford) This was in a one way street which had recently changed direction - the 'hangout' was only a couple of hundred yards from the end the Victoria Road - so, I went up it the wrong way - unfortunately a car was coming the other way - I stopped and I could see the car was full up with four burly guys - one of them started shouting at me - that was enough and fearing for my safety tried to do a 'U' turn in the road - Mini's have a poor turning circle and ended up driving up the pavement on a pub forecourt, inside a lamp post and back to the Victoria Road before driving off as fast as I could with the dark blue car following me flashing head lights etc. I managed to get as far as South Street when I realised something was up with several marked police cars then chasing and heading me off. The unmarked car with the coppers finally come up to me with one them asking "what the 'kin hell did I think I was doing and not stopping for them" - as mentioned before a simple (but grovelling) explanation mentioning that their car was unmarked, no blue lights or siren - four big geezers in it shouting at me - what did they expect? Anyway I got away just having to show my documents a the local nick.

[SaucyBoy]

Turboshmick said:

OFF DUTY is exactly what he was!
.

Mate it isn't as simple as that I'm afraid. Basically an Off Duty Officer just isn't getting paid at that moment in time. However as he/she holds the Office of Constable or what ever rank they may be, they have a duty to deal with Crime both 'On and Off' duty. For example, said Officer is in a pub with mates. Next to them a fight instigates and they witness someone get injured. It does not matter that they are off duty, they have to deal with it. Not to do so will leave them liable to 'Wilful neglect of duty'!! Worth noting that even Off Duty as you put it a Copper can still exercise their Powers and make arrests etc.

Now obviously they can risk assess the situation (Re the fight example) and call for help etc as to get in the middle of a fight with safety equipment etc could be stupid. But they MUST deal.

So back on track with the original topic. The alleged Off duty Cop approaches your car when you are stopped. Firstly he could not stop you as he has no power to do so in plain clothes. However as you are there he can deal. BUT, by identfiying himself as a Copper and thus representing his Service and the Office of constable/what ever rank means that he should deal with you in the correct manner and NOT make empty threats re paying you a visit when next On duty etc. So really he was in the wrong to come on that strong and obviously there is grounds for a compliant if that is how you want to go.

However that said mate your write up shows that you clearly have committed the offence of Dangerous Driving. It matters not that he was in the wrong by tailgating. Your 'Brake testing' clearly caused them to swerve etc and is clear evidence. At this point if the circumstances were right you could have been arrested (However most would just summons but arrest is an option, keep in mind that a Copper can arrest for Littering!!!). The Copper obviously didn't take it further as he knew he was in the wrong for tail gating etc and for blowing his lid.

I would put it down to experience mate and not brake test people from now on lol. Both of you appear to have been in the wrong and he shouldn't have said what he did etc. But I too would be angry if some one had done that as I'm sure you would be too.

Be safe out there fellas

[Lunablack]

Brake testing is the action of a tt....

[greygoose]

Lunablack said:

Brake testing is the action of a tt....

Exactly.

[streaky]

Turboshmick said:

OFF DUTY is exactly what he was!

Before we get into another round of debunking this statement, I suggest people read this extensive thread

Streaky

[wildcat45]

Off duty or not, what is the view on a copper swearing at someone?

Say the person stopped was a little older, perhaps not someone who considers the F word normal paralnce these days?

You are pulled over by an unmarked car - you don't know they are cops, its dark, you fear something like a hijack or road rage attack, and then the person starts swearing.

Alarm? Distress?

I think in certain circumstances, swearing is highly approriate, but certainly not as an opening to a conversation with a driver.

Imagine the reaction if you got stopped and you said to a cop "What the fk do you want?" The chances of a trip down the nick for a chat would be pretty high.

[GrumpyTwig]

Only ever give a flash of the lights personally as I know how far the pedal needs to travel to trigger the lights, otherwise find it best just to slow right down.

Sounds like the 'officer' hardly presented himself in a great light, probably left you be as he realised that his driving in itself was threatening/dangerous to a greater or lesser degree. Or his badge wasn't real.

[wildcat45]

When I did some work with the army a few years ago, I asked our driver what happens if the police stop them, bearing in mind the vehicle had comms gear in it, and potentialy weapons.

He told me they say to the officer that they will follow him to the nearest nick to sort it out there.

Perhaps with the case above, that woudl be a good course of action.

"Officer, I am sorry that I misinterpreted your actions ast threatening, but hearing in mind your non-liveried car, private plate, and your lack of uniform, not to mention your swearing, I feel rather intimidated. I will drive to the nearest police station unless you have an objectino to this. If you do object, can I ask that you get a market car to attand, as you are maiing me feel quite scared right now."

Not that you would actually do that. If the guy was a Walk, he'd son Foxtrot, leaving you with a good reason to report a fake bobby.

[moreflaps]

Don't brake test cars. You could easily have caused a massive accident. If you feel the car behind is too close, slow right down and let them overtake. WTF is your problem?

Cheers

[Ki3r]

Least you didn't do it to a marked car!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M5dL4DPm-DE

(NSFW, lots of swearing!).

Brake testing is a big no no.

[Shaw Tarse]

Ki3r said:

Least you didn't do it to a marked car!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M5dL4DPm-DE

(NSFW, lots of swearing!).

Brake testing is a big no no.

Shame that trucker has edited his other video!

[anonymous-user]

That doesn't reinforce any stereotypes I had about truckers

[Mrs Muttleysnoop]

When someone tailgates you, pull over let them overtake you and make a note of their reg no.

Edited by Mrs Muttleysnoop on Sunday 4th November 18:39

[Red 4]

La Liga said:

That doesn't reinforce any stereotypes I had about truckers

The trucker had a fair point though

[Derek Smith]

benjr said:

. . . at no point am I saying what I did wasn't wrong...

When driving home last night I was being tailgated by a BMW with personalised plates, This went on for a good few minutes before I was hacked off enough to brake test him

Most police officers would ignore traffic offences when off duty. In my force there was a force order to say that a prosecution would only be considered in exceptional circumstances. I've never did so although I've phoned in a few suspected drunk drivers, twice leading them to be bagged and prosecuted. I've ignored everything else except for one case.

I saw a chap 'brake-test' an old boy driving about 10mph below the 60mph limit. I reported him and it went to court and got him disqualled. I thought that a job well done.

If you are being tailgated there is only one sensible option: let the person go. Even if you are not seen and reported by an off duty police officer then it is still stupid to brake-test them.

[Lunablack]

Derek Smith said:

If you are being tailgated there is only one sensible option: let the person go. Even if you are not seen and reported by an off duty police officer then it is still stupid to brake-test them.

The type that brake test more often than not will be the same idiots that put their foot down when being overtaken

tts in both cases..